Color matching

[viswanaathan_r]

Hi,
Please put up with this rudimentary question. When a print buyer specifies a pantone number as a reference for color and the job is to be say matt laminated, whether the printer should match the color before or after matt lamination

[gordo]

Hi,
Please put up with this rudimentary question. When a print buyer specifies a pantone number as a reference for color and the job is to be say matt laminated, whether the printer should match the color before or after matt lamination

If the printer knows what the color will look like after lamination and as a result can match the color after lamination then that is what the printer should do.

However, most printers do not know how a PMS color will shift as a result of lamination and should tell the customer that the hue may, sometimes dramatically, shift as a result of the lamination process.

If you can do a draw down of the PMS color on the correct stock and laminate it then you might be able to predict the hue shift.

As always, communicate. There are areas where the result is difficult to predict. Let the customer know this so that they are prepared.

best, gordo

[Lukas Engqvist]

I haven't seen a Pantone book for laminated. The only books I know (which is what can be used for matching) are for matt, coatad and uncoated…*if you are looking at laminated which book do you expect the printer to match? The only way you can get what you want is to have a discussion with the printer about what you want. Matching to a laminated surface would be very hard. It would mean that the printer would need to print his own guide of potential matches, keep one copy laminate the other, then use the laminated copy to match, and his pre-laminated print as a target for his own matching (which would be dry and he is probably printing wet)

So asking the printer to target a pantone from a standard swatch book with laminated print is asking much . Are you willing to pay for the research?

[Cornishpastythighs]

Maybe the printer could get the customer to ok an ink drawdown that was half matte coated. This would at least show them how much the matte would change the colour and it would be cheaper.

[Gianni_S]

Hi all,
we shall consider the fact that during lamination the roll may vary its transparency... this is an annoying problem!
I've noticed different hue variation from a roll to another roll during lamination; always using the same type of material (it was gloss lamination). Going on matt lamination the change is dramatically worst.
I'm practically born in a pressfarm, in the last 30 years I've learned that PMS color should match with print without lamination... Sorry, no one can predict the color variation during lamination.
Bye!

[Correct Color]

If you're printing a spot color traditionally, for a whole lot of reasons it's really only feasible to match before, unless the client understands up front that there's going to be quite a bit of cost incurred in attempting to match after.

If you're printing digitally, however, and in particular large format, and this is a media/laminate combination you use a lot, it's certainly possible to do a laminated profile of the material. Set up correctly, that'd give you your best shot at PMS color matching after lamination.


Mike Adams
Correct Color

[Lukas Engqvist]

We actually printed a CMYK IT8.7 and laminated it, or rather had a test chart and slipped it along once we had a job that needed laminating, I did an ICC on that chart. The matt books never match laminating, it's a different method and colour behaves different some pigments (reds) are enhanced by the laminate for some reason.

[oldschool]

We roll out spot colors on two sheets. We laminate one and check to see final color. Lamination cycles vary due to time and temperature and can shift your color dramatically.

[viswanaathan_r]

Thanks folks for the answers. My current problems is both my ink suppliers are not answering my phone - I do not have inhouse ink kitchen you see.

[rich apollo]

A lot depends on the production of the final piece. If you're running spot colors I wonder if you could proof out a sheet of Pantone swatches, laminate it, read the result with a spectrophotometer, and then edit the look up tables of your proofing RIP. Most proofing RIPs exclude spot colors from the color transforms and pull color values directly from internal look up tables.

If you're running process, then you'll have to utilize a two proof solution. You have to proof to match the final laminated product for the client, and you'll have to send a proof for the unlaminated result to match on press.

If you need it, I have a file with 1500 Pantone swatches (the complete coated library from INDD CS4) that I can share with you.