Rampage ver Agfa Apogee

[stargate]

Does anyone have pro and cons?

[Colorblind]

I'm an ApogeeX user that I mainly use to produce final trapped composite PDFs. Had a demo of Rampage at a Graphic show last fall and the Fuji guy told me that such PDFs couldn't be produced out of Rampage. True or false? I don't know, just thought it was strange...

[Hopkins Printing]

As far as I know (someone correct me if I am wrong), unlike ApogeeX, Rampage does not have a separate Normalizer for making PDF files on its front end.

Kind regards,
Jon Morgan
Hopkins Printing

[macphenom]

Rampage can produce trapped composite pdfs through the NORM workflow. The advantage of Rampage in my opinion is you can have two workflows.
NORM or ROOM unlike other systems out there.

[Hopkins Printing]

Hi macphenom,

I think my last message was a little vague. To reiterate, as far as I know, unlike ApogeeX, Rampage does not have a separate Normalizer with which to make a PDF from original content (InDesign, Quark, etc.) which can then be used in the rest of the Rampage workflow.

That aside, yes it can produce ripped and trapped PDF files from ripped data.

Kind regards,
Jon :-)

[rich apollo]

Haven't run Rampage, but I'm currently running ApogeeX v3.5. Apogee seems pretty inefficient. I've run Contex, Brisque, and TrueFlow before this.

As to the other comments posted, ApogeeX can export a PDF, but it can't export a trapped PDF - can it?

Lastly, take a look at SMA costs. Agfa is pretty pricey for support.

[Hopkins Printing]

Hi Rich,

Yes, ApogeeX can export a trapped PDF if you have the PDF Trapper license.

What do you find inefficient about ApogeeX?

Kind regards,
Jon Morgan
Hopkins Printing

[rich apollo]

I find that PrintDrive is a big time waster. Forces you to screen everything way before you need to.

If I want to generate a proof (we're using Apogee to drive our Sherpas) I can't click on something that says "Proof It", I have to go in and edit the entire "plan" for the job.

Generating Impo proofs, again requires that you've screened the files all ready. That's backward.

If you want to use a different plating curve, whether due to a change in press or stock, you must RE-render (or screen) the file. Screening should never occur until plating.

It may be a product of how our system is set up, but I find that if I place a proofing "branch" in a plan the job just grinds waaaaay tooooooo sloooooooowllyyyy.

Apogee screens all channels of a job before you can plate it. Other systems screen a channel and then send it to the platesetter. The next color (or "plane") is being screened while the previous one is imaging.

You cannot cancel a process - you can only put it on hold.

In PrintDrive you can't see the order that jobs are queued up in for plating or impo proofs.

No trap editor.

PageStore doesn't give you the option of wiping out a file once you import it into a job. You end up maintaining a copy of the file in the PageStore, in the job, and in PrintDrive.

Again, it may be how our system is set up, but the number of computers and "shares" in our system is mind-boggling.

You cannot copy pieces of workflows (or "plans") either into other jobs, or simply another branch of the same job.

Every time you click on a job, on System Overview, on Hot Tickets, on Jobs, on the job editor a new window opens.

I do like the Mac Client very much. The integration with Preps is pretty good - but I've seen some strange errors (marks that don't print out, stuff like that).

[Hopkins Printing]

Hi Rich,

Compared to Rampage, ApogeeX is not...really...a ROOM workflow, I agree. There might be some purchasable options available for ApogeeX that might make it behave more like Rampage though.

Based on some of your comments...

I am curious if you use ticket templates. If you don't, you can set up default ticket templates. For example, a template that is only for sending a job to your Sherpa. After the template is created and saved, you can use it as many times as needed and the cool thing is, the system will create a new ticket from the template thus leaving the template itself untouched. We have a ticket template that is only for sending to our Epson's. Outside of that, I have templates that are broken down by Press, then by color mode (keep spot versus all process), then by paper type (coated versus uncoated), then by screening type (ABS versus Sublima), then by line frequency (133, 175, etc.). Might seem a little too much but it saves a lot of time when setting up a new job. The operator is only left with entering administration info, selecting pages from the Public PageStore, selecting a Preps template and associated options and then they submit the job.

Actually, you can cancel a process. In the Jobs screen, right-click on the job that the particular process in question is processing and choose "Mark as Finished". This will cancel the job.

We used to be a Rampage customer and I miss the trap editor. Although creating trap zones in Acrobat is not as elegant as the Rampage trap editor, it does work.

I agree, it would be nice when switching between System Overview, Hot Tickets, and Jobs that they be treated as real tabs rather than as separate windows (although I can think of reasons where having them as different windows could be a good thing).

How do you generate your impo proofs?

Kind regards,
Jon

P.S. Please don't take my comments as I am trying to argue the better workflow or the likes. I could feel the frustration in your words and I simply wondered if perhaps your Agfa trainer didn't show you some of its features.

[rich apollo]

> {quote:title=hopkinsprinting wrote:}{quote}
>
> P.S. Please don't take my comments as I am trying to argue the better workflow or the likes. I could feel the frustration in your words and I simply wondered if perhaps your Agfa trainer didn't show you some of its features.

Not at all, Jon. Actually, I've never been trained. Guess you could call it "work-study".

The imposition proofs are run out on a Sherpamatic driven by PrintDrive.

As to the ticket templates - the workflow that I've inherited has everything being done through hot folders. Ticket templates sounds more like what I'm used to. I feel that the requirements for a ticket are too much, though. I prefer more granularity. For example, I'd like to apply a ticket (or operation) that just proofed the file; or a ticket that simply plated the file for press "A" with such-and-such line screen.