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  1. #1
    mrrapid is offline Junior Member
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    Cool CMYK + Gloss Aq + Spot Dull Varnish

    I having trouble printing a job. Here are the specs: 4 color process plus gloss aq then flood dull varnish with a few highlight knockouts. The Paper is 130# Topkote Gloss Cover. The trouble I'm having is getting the dull varnish to lay down on top of the gloss varnish. I know it can be done because my competitors are doing it. When I do it, the piece either is not setting well or it looks good but is not drying hard enough to keep it from scratching. Is there a drying agent I should be adding to the varnish? We're in Las Vegas and Kramer inks is one of the big suppliers. Any suggestions?

  2. #2
    D Ink Man is offline Senior Member
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    You said gloss aqueous and then gloss varnish. Which is it?
    Also, in line or off line? Then we can go from there.
    Do not become an ink chemist please. Let your ink supplier do the work so you can run press ready materials. If they can't, switch to an ink supplier that has service, understands the products and processes and provides in house technical assistance. It's getting harder nowadays with all the middle entities selling products.

  3. #3
    RGPW17100 is offline Senior Member
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    Sounds like the effect you are looking for is called a strike through varnish. This would be a dull strike through varnish then inline gloss aqueous. The effect is most notible on dark solids like rich black or navy blues. Ask your ink provider about strike through varnish.

  4. #4
    amgd1972 is offline Junior Member
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    Hi,

    been there, done that, have the wounds.........

    In the end I ran, b,c,m,y and flood gloss in run one.
    Duct Matt UV on Run two......the strike through took 24 hrs to show effect...felt it was too risky!


    Ace

  5. #5
    dana is offline Member
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    when doing the strike-through varnishing, we've found that you need to run more varnish than usual. C&A coatings recommends adding 1oz of opaque white to 1pound or matte varnish

  6. #6
    Jimbo is offline Member
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    Yep, check with your ink supplier about strike through varnishes. It creates a really cool effect and is locked in tight with your coating. But, monitor your heat settings carefully.

  7. #7
    D Ink Man is offline Senior Member
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    If you're going the strike through varnish method, the best results are achieved when you can use the highest hold out, highest gloss coated stock that's possible. Then coverages such as rich blacks, and heavier 4/C builds will heighten your effect. The addition of opaque white to the STV does also help some. 5% addition is a good median amount. You will have to do some various runs to see what varnish product provides the best contrasting effect. In my experience you can stay with your regular gloss aqueous coating or W&T coating. Once printed, the full effect of the STV for dullness and resulting contrast with the gloss coating will vary with time. I would say that after 2 hours of printing you will be at least at 90% of the amount of dullness that of the final printed product. The STV is a great innovation, developed within the last 5 to 7 years, but remember, it will not ever be as dull as printing off line with a conventional dull sheet fed varnish onto an imprintable printed piece. But for a 5 or 6 unit press, printing with the STV, is faster based on the one pass in line method. Just bear in mind these expectations before embarking on a print job.

  8. #8
    tmason is offline Member
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    mrrapid,


    With the current job you are trying to fix, it could be that your gloss AQ is not over-printable.
    We have had this situation before and had to hit the AQ with another Aq gloss that we could overprint, maybe even a primer if it is really bad.
    Also, Matte varn is notorious for scuffing. Try adding some wax and grapho drier to the varn. You can also add a little drier to your water, similar to if you were printing on plastic.
    Or, as the other people suggested, try a Matte Varn made for plastic.
    We have found the best product to be Toyo Low tack Matte Varnish for this process.

    I like the look of this method. It gives much more contrast than doing a strike through in line. However, there are downfalls as you have discovered and if you have long runs, it is not practical to varnish offline.

    Good luck


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