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Landa S10 Cost Per Impression Thoughts

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  • #16
    Thank you for your contribution Erik. It was wonderful per usual.

    D

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    • #17
      Honest question; what would be the value of the Landa S10 over a B1 sized Indigo? Is it just speed?

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      • #18
        Originally posted by arossetti View Post
        Honest question; what would be the value of the Landa S10 over a B1 sized Indigo? Is it just speed?
        From what was first being said about the Landa was that it was going to be much cheaper per impression. But idk how true that is because no one has been able to provide any type of "click charge" or anything.

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        • #19
          From what i can see it seems the selling point of the s10 is that it is SUPPOSED to be the perfect combo of offset and and variable data printing. It appears that it has the speed and quality of a heidelberg with the automation and variable capabilities of the indigo. Now whether or not it is actually going to live up to the hype we will not know for awhile. I believe if it works the way landa promotes it then there are companies that could benefit. Any one that still has the workload for a big iron heidelberg or kamori that also wants to dive into variable data could use it. As far as click charges i don't think it will have much success if it is much higher than that of the indigo or igen. As a side note it looks like a uk company called reflex labels has put in the first official order for one of these bad boys so they would be the ones to watch.
          Last edited by DannyB; 02-14-2017, 11:31 AM. Reason: ADD ON

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          • #20
            Originally posted by DannyB View Post
            As far as click charges i don't think it will have much success if it is much higher than that of the indigo or igen. As a side note it looks like a uk company called reflex labels has put in the first official order for one of these bad boys so they would be the ones to watch.
            I think your pretty wrong here. To me they would have to have a click charge significantly lower than the iGen or indigo. From everything I read, with what they're wanting to do, they need to shoot for offset cost per impression to the 20 and 30 THOUSAND impression marks. To me it does no good to have a machine that can run like the heidelbergs of the cost is still going to be the same as running an iGen. All it means is your getting to the end of a run faster. Which is good, but I don't see there being a huge need for that except in just a few companies.

            Now if a company can use it to do massive variable data jobs AND static long runs that would normally be done offset, then we're talking something spectacular.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by AP90 View Post

              I think your pretty wrong here. To me they would have to have a click charge significantly lower than the iGen or indigo. From everything I read, with what they're wanting to do, they need to shoot for offset cost per impression to the 20 and 30 THOUSAND impression marks. To me it does no good to have a machine that can run like the heidelbergs of the cost is still going to be the same as running an iGen. All it means is your getting to the end of a run faster. Which is good, but I don't see there being a huge need for that except in just a few companies.

              Now if a company can use it to do massive variable data jobs AND static long runs that would normally be done offset, then we're talking something spectacular.
              I see your point and the more i look into it I think you are right the website is claiming that it will be cheaper than your other digital formats.

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              • #22
                the website also seems to be pushing it for packaging that is what they are mostly talking about on there. It supposedly can do everything from regular text weight up to corrugated stocks.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Erik Nikkanen View Post
                  I just noticed that at InfoTrends in Dec 2016, Komori stated that their version of the S10, the NS40 will be fully available in the Spring of 2018 after NS40 is finished its beta testing at a printer in Belgium with Landa.
                  Am I understanding this correctly? Komori is beta testing a brand new press design at 'a' printer (as in singular) and then will be ready to release the press. Sounds like everybody receiving an NS40 in Spring of 2018 will be beta testers too.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by kansasquaker View Post

                    Am I understanding this correctly? Komori is beta testing a brand new press design at 'a' printer (as in singular) and then will be ready to release the press. Sounds like everybody receiving an NS40 in Spring of 2018 will be beta testers too.
                    I believe that Landa will be beta testing its version of the press at several printers, so there will be testing done at more than one printer even though the Komori design is not exactly the same as Landa's. I am assuming the function of these presses is basically the same.

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                    • #25
                      I don't know the exact details but Komori is making the feeder and delivery on the Landa machine as well. I would also think that the whole paper handling inside the machine is also done by Komori except of course the ink laying part. So there should be quite a lot of common parts in both machines. Anyway Komori being traditional Japanese company in a sense that they want to be 100% about a product before they release it would make sense that they release their version after Landa, who probably has huge pressure to start selling the product.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Erik Nikkanen View Post

                        I believe that Landa will be beta testing its version of the press at several printers, so there will be testing done at more than one printer even though the Komori design is not exactly the same as Landa's. I am assuming the function of these presses is basically the same.
                        In a Printweek article about the selling of the Landa metallography technology to Altana, there are some interesting comments from Benny Landa at the end of the article about the first Beta testing of their press.

                        http://www.printweek.com/print-week/...o-ldp-investor

                        It seems there is a bit more of a delay. The first testing at a printer will be in the summer of 2017 and not at the beginning of the year as first reported.

                        Interesting that one of the reasons for selling the metallography tech was to put more effort into the Nanography tech. Maybe a better reason to sell was to improve the financial position.

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                        • #27
                          Ah Erik, you read the tea leaves well.

                          In this case however the tea is not oolong, it is SO LONG. And everyone is getting a taste!

                          D

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Erik Nikkanen View Post
                            I believe that Landa will be beta testing its version of the press at several printers, so there will be testing done at more than one printer even though the Komori design is not exactly the same as Landa's. I am assuming the function of these presses is basically the same.
                            The first two years of the Komori LS press were utter rubbish. You'd have been a lot better off with the last years of the L series. Integrating a completely new ink application methodology with existing systems sounds like a much more daunting task than the relatively incremental changes made between the last L and the first LS presses. That seems like a really shoddy approach to an unproven technology . . . or the presses are much further off than 2018 and they're just full of it. The latter is my guess.

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                            • #29
                              Israeli vehicle less ink. I think it perhaps could be on one of those 7 newly discovered planets. But I kind of doubt it.

                              D

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