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  • Can I upgrade Fiery?

    Ok, so two questions...

    1. We currently have a Xerox C560 with integrated Fiery controller and we’ve just placed an order for a new Konica also with integrated Fiery. I am assuming the new printer will use the latest version of command workstation, but when I try to use the latest version with the xerox, I get an error saying the server is not supported. So, what I was wondering is whether I can upgrade the ‘server’ software on the C560 to allow me to use the latest version of command workstation.

    2. The specs of the integrated Fiery on the Konica look pretty naff but I just couldn’t justify the extra cost of the external Fiery. However, does anyone know if it’s possible to swap the CPU in the Fiery for a more powerful model?

  • #2
    Will upgrading the fiery void your maintenance agreement? I doubt the techs will upgrade it and it still be covered.
    (2) Ricoh Pro 7110SX digital printers
    OKI C931e with Straight Shooter Envelope feeder

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    • #3
      Service upgraded my fiery when I added a new machine, for this same issue, BUT the new piece is from the same company. So it can be done ... will they or at what cost?

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Shawnd View Post
        Will upgrading the fiery void your maintenance agreement? I doubt the techs will upgrade it and it still be covered.
        I'm not sure if I'm honest and not even sure it'd be worth doing (we've managed fine with the integrated fiery on our Xerox).


        Originally posted by bill kahny View Post
        Service upgraded my fiery when I added a new machine, for this same issue, BUT the new piece is from the same company. So it can be done ... will they or at what cost?
        Was yours an external fiery? I ask because you mention adding a new machine which would obviously increase the toll on the server but the integrated fiery would only ever be able to run the machine it's attached to.

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        • #5
          You are mistaken on why they don't allow you to upgrade. It is the operating platform on which the Fiery is built that is the limiting factor. Most new presses will be able to accommodate or come with the new versions of CWS and it's accompanying applications, but the embedded or integrated Fiery RIPs are not of the same build as the external RIPs. I would bet that the newest model Xerox C60/C70 use the newest version of the RIP software on even their integrated/embedded RIPs. We still have a Xerox Workcentre 7775, and our RIP is the older version so we still are using CWS whatever version. You can't upgrade the processor or RAM to accommodate the newer version of CWS, it's the core OS or code that is on the machine hindering it. It broke our link to all of our HotFolders that shot the files to the 7775 when we upgraded our J75's CWS and HotFolders version, so I understand where you are coming from.

          Edit: I'm sure that if you change the parts on your Fiery, and it is under a service contract and Xerox somehow found out, that they would walk in and take the machine from your building. 99% certain that it's in your lease not to touch the internals of the machine, let alone install any non-approved software on the Fiery.

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          • #6
            Each of my machine have a separate fiery one intergrated and now 2 external. My newest fiery running the latest version of CW can log all 3. When the new printer and its fiery were installed it came with the latest version. CW can log other fierys' on the network, I wanted to control all the machines from one spot so they updated the CW versions. They still have different versions running but I would think xerox could update the CW version that both works within the fiery's limits and can talk to a newer cw version elsewhere on the network.

            I have 1 running 5.7... and 2 at 5.8 I guess its not the latest version sorry
            Last edited by bill kahny; 07-19-2018, 12:26 PM.

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            • #7
              I often temp at print rooms that run old Xerox copiers e.g DC 240, 250, 260, 550 J series, etc. They have the same problem. The solution is to install an older version of CWS on one PC and a newer version on another PC. Unfortunately you cannot move jobs between the older & newer versions of CWS and so you just have to send the print job again to the desired printer. Also you need two EFI Impose dongles one for the newer and one for the older. This is a problem if you are buying them second hand - insist on using them first. Make sure the integrated RIP is actually a Fiery and not something masquerading as one.
              System6.0.7, Illustrator'88, FreeHand2.02, PageMaker3.02CE. . .

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              • #8
                Originally posted by PricelineNegotiator View Post
                You are mistaken on why they don't allow you to upgrade. It is the operating platform on which the Fiery is built that is the limiting factor. Most new presses will be able to accommodate or come with the new versions of CWS and it's accompanying applications, but the embedded or integrated Fiery RIPs are not of the same build as the external RIPs. I would bet that the newest model Xerox C60/C70 use the newest version of the RIP software on even their integrated/embedded RIPs. We still have a Xerox Workcentre 7775, and our RIP is the older version so we still are using CWS whatever version. You can't upgrade the processor or RAM to accommodate the newer version of CWS, it's the core OS or code that is on the machine hindering it. It broke our link to all of our HotFolders that shot the files to the 7775 when we upgraded our J75's CWS and HotFolders version, so I understand where you are coming from.

                Edit: I'm sure that if you change the parts on your Fiery, and it is under a service contract and Xerox somehow found out, that they would walk in and take the machine from your building. 99% certain that it's in your lease not to touch the internals of the machine, let alone install any non-approved software on the Fiery.
                You completely misunderstood my two questions.

                I was asking two seperate questions about two seperate fiery's. I was asking:

                1) Can I upgrade the software on my Xerox C560 fiery to work with Command Workstation 6? END

                2) On the NEW fiery that's coming with my new KM 3070, can the CPU be upgraded? END

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by bill kahny View Post
                  Each of my machine have a separate fiery one intergrated and now 2 external. My newest fiery running the latest version of CW can log all 3. When the new printer and its fiery were installed it came with the latest version. CW can log other fierys' on the network, I wanted to control all the machines from one spot so they updated the CW versions. They still have different versions running but I would think xerox could update the CW version that both works within the fiery's limits and can talk to a newer cw version elsewhere on the network.

                  I have 1 running 5.7... and 2 at 5.8 I guess its not the latest version sorry
                  When I tried using Command Workstation 6 with the Xerox C560, I get a message saying the server isn't supported so it sounds like all your machines are 'new enough' for Command Workstation 6. It might be worth me logging a call with Xerox support but I can't see them being too keen to help when they find out it's because I'm getting a new Konica and not a new Xerox.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by minch View Post
                    I often temp at print rooms that run old Xerox copiers e.g DC 240, 250, 260, 550 J series, etc. They have the same problem. The solution is to install an older version of CWS on one PC and a newer version on another PC. Unfortunately you cannot move jobs between the older & newer versions of CWS and so you just have to send the print job again to the desired printer. Also you need two EFI Impose dongles one for the newer and one for the older. This is a problem if you are buying them second hand - insist on using them first. Make sure the integrated RIP is actually a Fiery and not something masquerading as one.
                    Fortunately we don't use Fiery Impose, we use a third party imposition program. Running Command Workstation 5 on one PC and version 6 on another will be a real PITA and will probably result in us just not using the Xerox again.

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                    • #11
                      Hi
                      From the EFI Fiery website. CWS ver 6 only works with newer Fiery operating systems.
                      Here is the link for more info: https://www.efi.com/products/fiery-s...rted-printers/
                      Here is the matrix for the different Fiery operating systems(pic)
                      You cannot upgrade older Fiery's to newer Fiery operating systems. Example: a version 8.0 to a FS300, won't work. Some controllers were Windows based with Fiery OS on top of it. Fiery migrated to Linux based embedded controllers to improve performance, again you could not upgrade these. The Fiery OS is engineered based on amount of RAM and CPU rating. Even with more RAM in a older Fiery the CPU would not be able to perform due to CPU.
                      Best solution for older Fiery's as previously mentioned is to run two version of Command Workstaiton, ver 5.3 for the older units and Version 6.x for the newer. The matrix shows which Fiery's are supported with the new Comand Workstation ver 6.x.
                      Hope this all makes sense and helps you out.

                      A Production Print Konica Minolta employee.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by gazfocus View Post

                        You completely misunderstood my two questions.

                        I was asking two seperate questions about two seperate fiery's. I was asking:

                        1) Can I upgrade the software on my Xerox C560 fiery to work with Command Workstation 6? END

                        2) On the NEW fiery that's coming with my new KM 3070, can the CPU be upgraded? END
                        Actually I totally understood your questions and my answers still apply:

                        1) No. The internal Fiery OS on your 560 is too old, just like our 7775 to allow CWS6 to run.

                        2) No. This will void your lease contract almost guaranteed. CPU upgrades are not easy in the first place on an existing system, so I would never attempt it on a proprietary system like Fiery that forbids you from modifying the hardware in any way. I do build computers from scratch regularly for what it's worth. I doubt even if you wanted to pay EFI $10k+ and they agreed to perform the upgrade that it would make enough of a difference since you'd be talking about a 15-25% CPU capability increase maximum.This was the edit part from my post. Reading it again it was indeed confusing.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by PricelineNegotiator View Post

                          Actually I totally understood your questions and my answers still apply:
                          Yes but your original reply was based on the idea of upgrading the hardware to allow me to upgrade the software, which wasn’t what I wanted to do. I was asking about upgrading software on one machine, and hardware on another.

                          However, thanks for the rest of the reply. As others have said. It’s not going to be possible to upgrade the software on the c560 which sucks but hey.

                          The cpu upgrade on the other machine is also not going to happen. It was just a curiosity rather than anything and while I certainly don’t agree that a cpu upgrade is difficult (I used to build computers for a living) and the service manual for the Fiery we are getting shows that the cpu cooler and cpu are removeable, it’s just not worth the risk of having my service agreement pulled if Konica ever found out.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by gazfocus View Post
                            Yes but your original reply was based on the idea of upgrading the hardware to allow me to upgrade the software, which wasn’t what I wanted to do. I was asking about upgrading software on one machine, and hardware on another.

                            However, thanks for the rest of the reply. As others have said. It’s not going to be possible to upgrade the software on the c560 which sucks but hey.

                            The cpu upgrade on the other machine is also not going to happen. It was just a curiosity rather than anything and while I certainly don’t agree that a cpu upgrade is difficult (I used to build computers for a living) and the service manual for the Fiery we are getting shows that the cpu cooler and cpu are removeable, it’s just not worth the risk of having my service agreement pulled if Konica ever found out.
                            Yeah, I attempted to answer you in my first post but I just made it a confusing mess. Agreed with your latter points.

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                            • #15
                              I didn't read through all of the replies so apologies if this was already answered, but I work for KM. My first suggestion is yes, you should upgrade the Fiery RIP on your Xerox by replacing the Xerox with another new Konica Minolta. Hah! But in all seriousness, thank you for your business. The easiest solution is to just use Command Workstation 5. The newest KM's still work on that. There is nothing life altering in CWS 6 that you will be missing by staying with CWS 5. I have a C3070 and C6085 in my demo room with CWS 6 on the computers in there, but I still have CWS 5 on my laptop and it's been working just fine.
                              A Konica Minolta production print specialist and former pre-press specialist.

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