Acrobat layers - production

[kaiserwilhelm]

We have a client that has submitted 300 single pdfs per month for years now. They have them setup with a nomenclature that flows through our PitStop and PitStop Server rather nicely.
They are now asking us to accept ONE pdf with 300 layers. (Example - Common LITHO A - with 50 LASER XXX_A versions. Then, Common LITHO B with 50 LASER XXX_B versions, etc)

I am quite perplexed as to how to get these into production? Obviously, I do not want to duplicate the single PDF 300 times and then turn off 299 layers on the first and SAVE AS, etc.

Am I missing some kind of automation here? I just do not see how I am going to extract these files halfway decent?
I am considering an Acrobat Script of some sort? We have an INDD script that does something similar (Turn on LITHO AA, Turn on LASER_XXX_AA, export PDF)

Ideas?

 

[rich apollo]

If you have a versioning module on your RIP you should be able to specify the base layer(s) and the version layers. It may save you a bunch of time.

 

[Stephen Marsh]

Just curious what source application they are using to create the 300 layer PDF and if this can be handled differently at the source?

Why the sudden change in how they supply art? New operator or manager? Different software?


Stephen Marsh

 

[abc]

Can you contact me off-forum, it would be nice to get a sample file and we'll see what we can do with PitStop that will help you out

 

[leonardr]

We have a client that has submitted 300 single pdfs per month for years now. They have them setup with a nomenclature that flows through our PitStop and PitStop Server rather nicely.
They are now asking us to accept ONE pdf with 300 layers. (Example - Common LITHO A - with 50 LASER XXX_A versions. Then, Common LITHO B with 50 LASER XXX_B versions, etc)

Excellent - this is a MUCH better and more modern solution!

I am quite perplexed as to how to get these into production?

Adobe Acrobat and Callas PDFToolbox have the ability to automatically split this into the 300 separate PDFs, if your RIP is older and does not support PDF layer control natively.

 

[kaiserwilhelm]

Leonard, I am downloading a trial of this.
Please riddle me this until then though.

I have discovered that a bullet (option 8) in any font automatically goes from embedded to embedded subset. Remove the bullet, VOILA - embedded.
So, if I have a 300 page pdf is Times New Roman, if just ONE page uses a bullet, then all 300 pages now get subset font for Times New Roman.
In my world, that is VERY bad. I need that font to be embedded.

1. Is Adobe aware of this "bullet / tilda" issue causing subset?
2. Do you see how this ONE pdf now having all subset fonts could affect me?

 

[leonardr]

I have discovered that a bullet (option 8) in any font automatically goes from embedded to embedded subset. Remove the bullet, VOILA - embedded.

It's not the bullet speicifially, but any character outside normal ASCII range. This is done in order to keep file size down and optimize accordingly.

In my world, that is VERY bad. I need that font to be embedded.

It is embedded - just embedded subset.

2. Do you see how this ONE pdf now having all subset fonts could affect me?

No, I can't. Why do you care that it's subset? Certainly embedded vs. non-embedded...but subsetting is a good thing.

 

[gig0]

Adobe Acrobat and Callas PDFToolbox have the ability to automatically split this into the 300 separate PDFs, if your RIP is older and does not support PDF layer control natively.

Hey Leonard, this is new to me but would you happen to know if the upcoming Prinergy 6 supports layer control?

 

[Joe]

Prinergy 5 supports layer control...if you buy that option.

 

[kaiserwilhelm]

When this is imported into GMC Inspire, the ENTIRE font is now bad.
Example - Now is the time for all good men to come to the aid of their country. *Times New Roman - Embedded. Comes into GMC PERFECT.
Example - •Now is the time for all good men to come to the aid of their country. *Times New Roman - Subset. Destroys ANY place that TNR is used. Not just the bullet. IE, makes ALL TNR useless and requires 20 minutes to unsafely fix.

It's not the bullet speicifially, but any character outside normal ASCII range. This is done in order to keep file size down and optimize accordingly.



It is embedded - just embedded subset.




No, I can't. Why do you care that it's subset? Certainly embedded vs. non-embedded...but subsetting is a good thing.

 

[leonardr]

When this is imported into GMC Inspire, the ENTIRE font is now bad.
Destroys ANY place that TNR is used. Not just the bullet. IE, makes ALL TNR useless and requires 20 minutes to unsafely fix.

I don't know what GMC Inspire is - but if it's a PDF processing tool that can't handle subset fonts, I would RUN FAR FAR AWAY....or at least contact their tech support.

 

[rich apollo]

This sounds like a good, old-fashioned font conflict. Sounds like GMC reads in the fonts for the entire job, rather than on a page by page basis. I'll bet it's not that it can't handle subset fonts, but that it's seeing this as more than one instance of the same font.

kaiserwilhelm, do you have PitStop? It's not a very elegant solution, but you could convert all the text to outlines before pushing the files into production.

Is your client working in InDesign? Take a look at Zevrix software. They have an InDesign plug-in (Output Factory) that will create individual files from a layered document. Has great controls for specifying layer combinations and naming conventions. Sounds like it would be worth it to buy this for your client. It'll save them a lot of time and give you what you want for file output. It's a really good product.

 

[gig0]

Prinergy 5 supports layer control...if you buy that option.

Thanks, Joe. I should have known better there was a license fee, LOL

 

[kaiserwilhelm]

I don't know what GMC Inspire is - but if it's a PDF processing tool that can't handle subset fonts, I would RUN FAR FAR AWAY....or at least contact their tech support.

GMC Inspire (Formerly Print Net T) is the industry standard (in my opinion) of software to drive a digital web press.
I believe (mark my words) that we will design in GMC within 2-3 years. Currently, we have to take a PDF from INDD and "tear" it apart. Make one part into the static LITHO (done with Pitstop) and one part into the copy that will become variable.
When I import that text into GMC, it does a hell of a job with ALL fully embedded fonts.
However, if a font is subset, it brings it in bad.
I have trained my employees and also those that I receive files from to change the settings on "Package" to "Include fonts and links from hidden and non printing content"
This helps in many areas. It does not beat the "bullet" issue.
I have setup a Pitstop Server action that has my entire font library assigned to it. If I receive a PDF that was subset out of ignorance (not hitting the button when packaging) it will actually FIX those. However, if the font is subset due to the bullet, there is no fix.
Trust me. I have tried. I have tried a substitution with Pitstop manually. No avail.

I know that this is a prepress forum. I get that you are an Adobe expert. I live in both of those worlds. However, I currently also live in a world of GMC Inspire that drives a digital web press at 500 fpm. Across a web, that is 4 (8.5 x 11) pages per foot roughly. So, I rip at 120,000 "pages" per hour.
I cannot take the chance of a font going bad on me.