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Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???

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  • Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???

    Simple document. Grayscale pics dropped into Quark. No layering. No transparency, etc.
    Just a simple pic.
    Command P with Acrobat 7 distiller as my setting. Print a ps into Distiller with good settings. NO profile
    management, etc.
    Out comes Crap.
    Take the same photos, drop into INDD 3. Export with the SAME settings as the distiller setting and
    out comes crisp, good.
    Any ideas??

    Here is the really evil thing about this. If I EXPORT from Quark 7.3 the pic looks good.


  • #2
    Re: Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???

    OPI perhaps from Quack? If so remove the OPI extension from the Quark Extensions folder.


    • #3
      Re: Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???

      Transparency is basically default built into the new applications. I get separated pdf (all colors as B&W on diferent pdf pages) which has been flattened and saved back to pdf 1.3, 1.4 or pdfx1a for me and it still screws up because of transparency (BTW that should not exist in this type of work), especially in multi color blends (even if cmyk). Print Quark files out of INDD, it works (BTW Q4 to INDD CS2 works, OS9 then Tiger; Q6, 7 does not go smoothly into INDD! There they go again, punishing us when it suits).

      But if you print postscript out of Quark and then distill it, the job will screw up.
      INDD does not work that way (export is not through ps) so it does not screw up. This was likely partly built into pdf somehow (the underpinnings of our field now) to work better and hurt the competition for awhile at the same time (see above).

      But Quark 7.3 now can handle those situations by going direct out as you state which is the same as export rather than printing postscript. It is Adobe's intention I imagine to do away with postscript completely even though let's face it, everything after the rip is essentially postscript. So we're taking native apps (ps apps!), using them in a different manner (export to pdf), ripping the file and converting to 1 bit tif (ahah, ps again!) to plot on a bitmap device.
      Genius but so selfish these people.
      Please spend more and more money to upgrade everything you do, new computers, more ram, new os, new apps, new rips, new workarounds. Don't forget that the apps interface changes everytime too so get learning folks and never stop or you're dead.



      • #4
        Re: Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???

        My RIP people (Trueflow) are telling me that I have CMS turned on?
        I do not think I do.
        What are the drawbacks to exporting out of Quark? Back in 6.5
        Trueflow told me to avoid exporting out of Quark like the plague.
        Is it better in 7.3??


        • #5
          Re: Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???

          Let me also throw this into the equation.
          If I Export out of Quark with AS IS turned on then it goes to crap again.
          I have to have the AS IS feature so it looks like I am screwed again....


          • #6
            Re: Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???

            They were right about Q6. And even in Q7 there was bad news until 7.3.1 Now it seems to be okay. "Seems to be", means test, test, test and test some more while paying attention!
            Remember that when Indesign first came out, the industry chose for the most part to stay with Quark. That annoyed Adobe no end so they worked hard to push Quark out into left field by various and sundry but arguably clever (in some's opinion) means. Now Quark is back more or less and the nonsense (which continually punishes us) will continue ad infinitum so keep watching. Recall that Adobe's marketing chose to basically give IND to many bigtime players in the US and many schools. So now we get all these so-called graduates with lots of IND practice and no Quark while the industry still uses Quark everyday in many shops.


            BTW, welcome again to our business!


            • #7
              Re: Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???

              I appreciate the reply. However, I still cannot get the desired results when AS IS is turned on.
              My hatred for Quark grows by the day.....


              • #8
                Re: Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???

                Would you believe me if I told you that I changed the pic in question from a TIff to an eps
                and all is well?
                Go figure. If anyone has any thought on why this would be, PLEASE let me know.


                • #9
                  Re: Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???


                  eps would mean flattened for sure. Tif can be layered now and still work! That's new AFAIK. And that means tif with transparency of course. Bummer and yet good.

                  In fact, we use eps to fix plenty. You may recall (if you're old enough) that an inclined pictue box with a tif and with a none background caused quality edge problems. Eps is a larger format and houses more info. So an eps of the same image had good edge. What's old is new again!



                  • #10
                    Re: Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???


                    Unfortunately, Quark exports PDF by making PostScript and letting Jaws PDF Creator do the conversion from PS to PDF.

                    I can see it now:
                    Quark will not allow exporting to PDF/X-4, and the last ones holding onto the dying corpse will be told by prepress to finally bury it.
                    (At least that's my hope)



                    • #11
                      Re: Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???

                      I am not developer but know this much, EPS is not larger format than tiff and it doesn't house more info.
                      How Quark deals with EPS is basically just let it through without touching it, which used to be selling feature and EPS works fine with Quark still.
                      Tiff always get "touched" or modified by quark.

                      Try colouring greyscale EPS in Quark, .. you can't.
                      Now try the same with greyscale tiff, .. got my point?

                      Adobe didn't need to give away their software, it is just superior to Quark and this is coming from sworn, dedicated Quark user.
                      I think I am still more proficient in Quark than Indesign but proper handling and output of Indesign have converted me as well as most of the industry.
                      What was once "almost" 100% Quark, now it is up to 70% Indesign and Quark shares 30% with rest of the Rubisher, Ragemaker, etc..
                      This is at least in our shop and I like it that way.


                      • #12
                        Re: Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???

                        Probably sticking my nose into the wrong place.

                        But. If you have not by now learned that what the screen shows is not
                        real by now...if not, well, gosh.

                        Second, a decade ago I threw away my HP scanners because the software
                        considered greyscale to be rgb with equal values per channel. Well,
                        (expletive) That ain't good.

                        The result of having to deal with these files (RGB "grey" into Quark
                        or ID for that matter!!!) is a mess. Late software requires one to
                        print separations if you have a mono file. If the contents are in
                        RGB, the result is (depending on the conversion preferences...and
                        that is critical!) a crappy black panel. Black should usually be a
               data, just pushes here and there.

                        If it comes from XP otherwise, you get an issue to resolve.

                        it is the image profiles. Fix em (unless they gave em to uu as cmyk,
                        in which case they are f***** as are you. back to rgb is not an option.

                        Stupid customer. Need to get the right files.


                        • #13
                          Re: Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???


                          Did you happen to have a white areas? Was it in a picbox with the background of NONE? Some RIPs just may not handle that. Check that out.



                          • #14
                            Re: Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???

                            I believe that Quark 7.3.1 now does allow direct to pdf and does not have to go through postscript anymore although it does when you hit print. They have to keep up n'est-ce-pas?


                            • #15
                              Re: Quark PDFs - Washed out - INDD 3 not...???

                              If you take a regular tif and save it as an eps(f), the file size will be larger. You are correct that Quark does not look inside the eps just to its perimeter where you can in fact trap if you want to; eg: image with clipping path, the path becomes the perimeter and Quark sees it. The eps workflow is still largely in use in packaging jobs using a separated workflow and application trapping. I have several colleagues who still do this, as do I, even though many of us also have Creos, Apogees, Trueflows etc for commercial work.


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