Acrobat Security

ajr

Well-known member
I would like your opinions on this:

We have been supplied a secure PDF from a print management company with it a long list of changes, new text logo etc. Apparently I am expected to get round the security and do the changes, job is fairly complex and they wont pay for it to be re-set. I bounced it back to the customer as I wont take resonsibility for any changes made to the document by getting round the security. I think they should resupply (they've probably lifted job from another supplier), but customer is not happy as we can't (won't) sort it out.

I would like to no what other people have done in this sort of situation, as I think I'm right not to touch it.

Thanks

AjR
 
I agree with your stance on this issue.
The customer needs to understand that you will do what you can WHEN you are provided the tools you need.
This is like taking your car to the dealer for a brake job but refusing to give them the keys to the car and the key to the security lug nuts. You wouldn't tell them to just "deal with it".
 
Security means that the person who made the PDF doesn't want the changes made without permission (or without charges). It's like breaking copyright privileges. I wouldn't touch it. It's kind of immoral. Client doesn't want to pay for the changes, too bad!
 
This is why you should never accept anything but PDF/X

This is why you should never accept anything but PDF/X

PDF/X prohibits security settings.

PDF is a 'ready to print' file format in general, and if it is to be a variable job, then they need to follow the PDF/VT specifications

PDF Standards - PDF/VT

ISO Standard - PDF/VT to Unify Production Workflows

This does not need to be a hostile encounter - this is a teaching moment, or if they have a supplier that can deal with this type of PDF, a learning moment for you and your team.

I would like your opinions on this:

We have been supplied a secure PDF from a print management company with it a long list of changes, new text logo etc. Apparently I am expected to get round the security and do the changes, job is fairly complex and they wont pay for it to be re-set. I bounced it back to the customer as I wont take resonsibility for any changes made to the document by getting round the security. I think they should resupply (they've probably lifted job from another supplier), but customer is not happy as we can't (won't) sort it out.

I would like to no what other people have done in this sort of situation, as I think I'm right not to touch it.

Thanks

AjR
 
They don't want to pay for changes they want? The PDF is locked and needs to be unlocked, which means you would have to buy an application to bypass security (I know there are workarounds). I wouldn't touch it for free considering the hassles. Considering your customer attitude, I'm not surprised he's been supplied a password-protected PDF...
 
I've had this but from the other direction, I had supplied a locked PDF catalogue proof to a customer who then went into administration (leaving my bill unpaid :mad:) and were bought out by another company.

Some time later I got a call from a printer who'd been asked to make alterations to the file and print it - they were suspicious as the file was watermarked with 'proof' and the halftones were low res.

I thanked them, told them the background, and they politely declined the work.

margadri is bang on - don't touch it.

A
 
Thanks for the input, unfortunately with most of our customers we dont get the opportunity to specify what sort of PDF we get. We do alot of trade work so we get quite a mixture. I'm sure the job is either from a designer or another printer who probably needs to be paid before he unlocks it. That could be me one day so I'm thinking its probably right not to touch, now I just need to tell my boss that!!

AjR
 
Although I'm a designer and usually a print customer, I occasionally run pre-press for one of our local litho houses, and I am horrified at some of the submitted files from 'proper' professional companies - brochures done in 6 year old versions of freehand, mono laser 'proofs', no bleed, no trim or fold marks, no folios, obvious typo's - all you pre-press guys know exactly what I mean.

However I helped them to devise a comprehensive 'standard file submission requirements' document that went with every quote, reserving the right to charge extra prepress time for 'fixing' out of spec artwork. While not really enforcible, it gave them the opportunity to go back to the customer and say 'resubmit as per our requirements or it will cost you £XX for us to fix it'.

It certainly helped reduce some of the s**t.

A
 
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You mail letters, right ?

You mail letters, right ?

Thanks for the input, unfortunately with most of our customers we dont get the opportunity to specify what sort of PDF we get.

When I prepare letter to be dropped into the mail, the mail service has some hard and fast rules on what they will and will not accept. They can't mail anything if I forget to include the street address, or place it on the back of the envelope. There are rules that must be followed to enable them to automate the process.

This is no different for prepress processing - if someone submits a job, you need to provide a method for the customer to have a basic check on that file before it is submitted into production. This is not some game of hide and seek.

I reject your excuse as to why you can't set up basic preflight tp test to see of a file meets the production requirements - all sorts of web2print service providers have preflight systems in place that check things like if the file is the correct size, if it is actually 2 sided, etc...

PDF file that have security setting have no business in an automated workflow.

You asked a question, that is the answer - automated workflows require a partnership where both parties agree to a business agreement, else it is total chaos.
 
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You'd think all this would be a thing of the past with Bin Laden out the way!

A
 
Michael,

I agree with you 100%.

Now, reality is that if I don't accept some of the crap PDFs that are presented, the client will just go somewhere else where they WILL accept their PDFs, do a bunch of our mumbo jumbo (I'm sure you'd recognize some of the hoops we all go through to get these things to print), and then the next time we'll hear, but so-and-so was able to do it, I thought you guys were professionals.

That's why I'm out there trying to teach design students to actually produce production viable PDFs. Even if some of the other teachers (designers, not production people) tell them, "oh, if you have a good printer they'll take care of all of that stuff for you."
 
PDF/X was developed for this reason

PDF/X was developed for this reason

Michael,

I agree with you 100%.

Now, reality is that if I don't accept some of the crap PDFs that are presented, the client will just go somewhere else where they WILL accept their PDFs, do a bunch of our mumbo jumbo (I'm sure you'd recognize some of the hoops we all go through to get these things to print), and then the next time we'll hear, but so-and-so was able to do it, I thought you guys were professionals.

That's why I'm out there trying to teach design students to actually produce production viable PDFs. Even if some of the other teachers (designers, not production people) tell them, "oh, if you have a good printer they'll take care of all of that stuff for you."

In a fully automated web2print workflow, no, there is no "prepress guy" - it is like pumping your own gas, you need to know the difference between unleaded and diesel or you will have a big mess on your hands.

And I am sorry, but again, this can be a teaching / learning moment - it never has to be a knife fight.

If there is an expectation of editing, you need to either have a password for password protected PDF, or ask for a version that does not require a password. If that can't be supplied, there is some business relationship that need to be addressed far before wasting time trying to break the encrypted PDF.
 
Sorry Michael, but the original post never indicated that it was a fully-automated workflow. Yes, in a VistaPrint, OneOver type of environment that's absolutely correct. But the majority of printers out there are still taking in PDFs, making corrections (as indicated in the original post) and doing all their other magic.

Just want to make sure we're apples-to-apples.
 
John,

We have to take the work where we can find it, we are in a position where we can't turn anything away. We have B2B Web 2 Print but most customers are so lazy and cant be bothered to use it or too scared!!! No matter how much we educate people they wont change!

A
 
Pigs ear to Silk Purse processing ?

Pigs ear to Silk Purse processing ?

Sorry Michael, but the original post never indicated that it was a fully-automated workflow. Yes, in a VistaPrint, OneOver type of environment that's absolutely correct. But the majority of printers out there are still taking in PDFs, making corrections (as indicated in the original post) and doing all their other magic.

Just want to make sure we're apples-to-apples.

@ John Clifford - LOL - when I read Web2Print, I think digital smart factory - I guess I should remember that to many, it is just a fancy email application / online form with the ability to upload a PDF file.

Reading AJR's comments, I think that is all that might be happening here.

Web2Print ( in my mind ) is more linke what companies like Mimeo are doing, where I am basically interacting with their API via SOAP or REST and setting up a process and executing it when they process my Credit Card.

I forget that some people think they can drop off "whatever" and ignorantly think it can be magically fixed by the pixel pushers that live inside the intertubes.
 
We have B2B Web 2 Print but most customers are so lazy and cant be bothered to use it or too scared!!! No matter how much we educate people they wont change!

A

We're having the same issue with our pringery/insite system. The customers we've convinced to use it absolutely love it, but everyone else would rather keep sending us crappy files through e-mail and ftp and let us sort out the mess they make :rolleyes: . Makes me glad I'm the wide format & lamination operator and not prepress.
 

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