Coating over metallic inks

[bert94]

Just had my press room manager tell me that we could not coat when printing metallic inks because it knocks the metallic effect down. Never heard of this to the extent that he is talking about. I have printed with other companies with no problem at all. Any info or experiences as to what he is talking about.

Thanks for your input

Robert

 

[GJOHN]

Re: Coating over metallic inks

Metallic inks will loose the "sheen" under a coating unless a special coatable, we call it "non leafing" silver, is used. The metalfx process, 5 color process where a thin layer of silver is printed first, has a coatable and non-coatable silver available. The non coatable siver is the standard silver and the coatble one is the "non-leafing silver". The non-leafing silver is much more expensive. When a customer UV coats a metallic color, we noramally make it a low VOC ink.
GJ

 

[Indexx Printing]

Try running a euro mettalic ink such as K&E. The mettalic pigment in these inks are a little more coarse and will give you a litte less of a deminished effect under the coating. Also check with Nicoat. I think they make a coating made for overprinitng mettalics. You can also reduced your tack and that will help a little. K&Es mettalics ar a little thicker than most and will handle the reducer better. We use Tegra Jelly reducer.

Thanks,
Todd

 

[roy35ka]

Any experience with film lamination over metallics? That is always a problem for us. We do not get consistantly good adhesion. Ideas?

 

[jlind]

I think laminating over a metallic would diminish any metallic effect that you achieved, by the gloss of the laminate. One other thing. When they grind and pulverize the metallic pigments they have to coat them with an oil like stearic acid or else the heat build up could lead to fires and explosions. The stearic acid is hard to get rid of and might bloom to the surface during heat lamination, since it is a non-drying oil. This would make the laminate look like it's not adhering. I might be wrong, but how could I possibly make this stuff up? I read about it in the Printing Ink Manual or American Ink Maker or Ink World.

John Lind
Cranberry Township, PA
724-776-4718

 

[Vee]

I don't the specifics to brands and what not, but we print metallic golds & silvers all the time and UV & AQ coat it w/ no problems.

 

[rich apollo]

Yeah, if you coat you'll lose some sheen. But if you don't, it'll mark and scuff like a mammy-jammy. You want shiny, shiny? Get it foil stamped. Metallic inks are always an exercise in disappointment - I don't care if they leaf, bloom, or grow a bean stalk.

 

[macphenom]

It will lose some of its sheen if you coat inline. I have had good luck coating metallics as a dry pass.
Also MetalFX is no longer marketed, they say the ink will still be available but they do not say for how long.

 

[RickC]

Try using VanSon Mettallics.
Never had any issues with other manufacturers but VanSon seems to work best under these circumstances

 

[Bret Hesler]

We've used the non leafing silver from Eckart for MetalFX. Very nice, very expensive.

 

[Color Logic]

metallics and lamination, varnish, coatings

metallics and lamination, varnish, coatings

If you are going to laminate, varnish, or aqueous seal any metallic ink it is imperative to use a non leafing pigment. The wetted pigments in the ink disperse in the ink film instead of leafing (floating) to the surface as with a normal metallic ink. Many people claim that you can't laminate a metallic, well, that is simply not true, you just need to use the right metallic ink for the job. The MetalFX non leafing ink, which costs around $30 per lb, product code MFX 06 9000 NL, is the one you need. This was developed for all these purposes. This ink can also be used for blister pack applications as well. Although the ink price of $30 a lb seems quite expensive, it should be noted that with the MFX system you printed a much thinner film weight (density) on press. It is advised to measure a metallic ink with a polarised densitometer, non polarised filters cannot accurately measure a metallic ink due to light reflection form the aluminum particles. historically a printer will always flood the metallic on press with the theory of the more they put down the more it will sparkle. this is also not true. The more ink you put down, the wetter it becomes, setoff increase, drying times take days. However, using the MFX ink with an increased pigment content meant that you print less ink, thus saving you money, speeding up drying times to just a few hours, it can be varnished, laminated etc etc. So, as many people claim, MFX is not special, the palettes are not what made MFX special its the inks and how you use them. As a guide, if you measured a normal metallic ink with a pol filter on a densitometer it would be around to 100 to 110 mark (density) with MFX it is measured around 070. So, over 30% thinner film weight. Now... do the math on that with the price per pound of the metallic ink and it reduces the price per page drastically.

the other key thing with metallic is substrate. Orientation of pigments are effected by substrates, whether they are coated, silk/dull, uncoated etc. and also the surface pitting. All these effect metallic. if an uncoated stock is used the metallic ink is absorbed into the substrate and thus you get a crap metallic effect. however, there are always ways to get an excellent metallic shine on uncoated paper and yet still retain that touchy feely effect that designers want when using FSC uncoated stocks. You just need to know who to ask...

 

[SpeedKing]

the same goes for flourescent inks too.

 

[Heidelberg]

Try 1 part gloss varnish to 5 parts metallic ink, this will cure your adhesion problems.