CIP3/CIP4 ink key generation from supplied 1-bit tiffs

[RVNG]

Hello folks,

We are receiving 1-bit tiffs generated by a workflow other than ours. I was wondering what options there may be to have ink keys generated from them? The 1-bits come from an Apogee system without the module necessary to generate the CIP3/CIP4 data. We run the most current Heidelberg Prinect Workflow and are trying to find an easy solution to this. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,
Christian.

 

[Anze]

Tray this link Excourse PressPerCent Information

 

[rich apollo]

Take a look at PressPerCent Excourse PressPerCent Information

It's inexpensive, too.

 

[RVNG]

Thanks rich apollo, downloading demo now. appreciate the link!

 

[Jzink]

Check out Keysetter from Xitron (I work there) : KeySetter Connect Press Console Ink Key Presetting

 

[Prepper]

How useful are key presets? Does press have to be ran the same way all the time? Same sweeps etc?
Just asking.

 

[Jzink]

KeySetter examines the file and generates the initial ink key settings and then produces a proprietary file format to be read by a specific press. Job data may be sent from the prepress workflow to KeySetter either as a TIFF, CIP3/CIP4 or if necessary, KeySetter may be equipped with its own low resolution RIP to provide the necessary input.

 

[Prepper]

I'm aware of how it works and the thought process behind it, but it only works as well as the press is ran consistent right? Same inks, papers, settings?

How does it account for changes the pressman makes, say setting sweeps up or down from one job to the next or if from job to job you run different papers, gloss, silk, uncoated?

 

[Jzink]

For this Keysetter Connect with Closed Loop would be needed. KeySetter Connect with Closed Loop takes the press operator one step further than ink key presetting by integrating a scanning spectrophotometer capable of reading (scanning) the entire press sheet color bar and feeding this data back to the KeySetter Connect software. The press operator can accept the scanned data and send feedback to the press console to adjust the ink keys. The scanner allows the press operator to more quickly read a color bar. Rather than reading only selected patches, the entire color bar is read by the scanner providing for even greater quality control throughout the press run. You have the ability to set up density standards, curves for different stocks and store the settings for reruns.

 

[Prepper]

Guess a better phrase might be "kept consistent" instead of "ran consistent." Asking as it kind of relates here, pressman changing things around quite a bit, inks sometimes, paper sometimes, sweeps, rollers, blankets, speeds, but at same time wants to add presetting because it will save time. If you aren't practicing good process control up front, will it do any good, or will it help enough to justify $13,000? For 200 jobs a year?

 

[Jzink]

Not trying to be a commercial on the forum, but the Xitron website has more information and an ROI tool that can be used to determine the payback. In most cases, the system can be paid for in less than a year with the reductions in makeready and waste reduction.

 

[RGPW17100]

The pre inking software will set the ink keys pretty close to where they need to be. The operator will need to make some adjustments to get the densities to where they should be. Optimization programs are available to make changes to the press curves that will make this a more accurate. Even without the optimization software the ink key presets are where an operator will know what moves need to be made before running the job to get close to the densities to make the job correct. Without the CIP3/4 your operator will spend a lot more time evaluating plates to set ink sweeps. In the event you have someone less experienced with the press the pre inking software will get that operator printing faster then trying to guess how to set the keys

 

[rich apollo]

How useful are key presets? Does press have to be ran the same way all the time? Same sweeps etc?
Just asking.

Hey, Prepper,
Do you like football? Ink key presetting is like getting possession of the ball with good field position - maybe the 45 yard line instead of the 20. Good field position doesn't guarantee a touchdown. Ink key presetting doesn't assure a color match. In each case there is still work to be done, but not quite as much. It's just a time and labor saving device.

$13,000? There are less expensive options.

 

[Prepper]

Yes, Rich, I know

In a theoretical world, but what if the ref runs back and forth spotting the ball on the field however he wants to at any given time?

We have PressPercents here for about 4 years now, once, I got feedback from the press and compared their final key settings to the ones I supplied them with from PressPercents (after we had tweaked it a little) and on our Heidelberg console with the settings I supplied them with, 75% of them were within the same larger setting, the keys have a large and a finer setting, like 2/15, 75% were within the 2 and only fine adjustment had moved from what Presspercent gave them.
We discussed it at that time about tweaking it further and from what I saw their sweeps would have to be consistent right? If they change sweep settings from job to job at startup, it isn't possible for presets to adjust for that is it? And since then I've never received any more feedback but the case is being made that this software will save us a lot at makeready.

So I was asking, will it if the sweeps are constantly changing?

 

[rich apollo]

<…the case is being made that this software will save us a lot at makeready. So I was asking, will it if the sweeps are constantly changing?>

Yes, I think it will, just not as much. It will set the keys to even out the ink take-off, but with changing sweeps the density will be off.

 

[Prepper]

Yes, that's right it would just be lighter or darker density. We are getting that with Press Percents already, they said it was balanced out, just too heavy, so they could lower the sweeps to start with, or I could curve it down some in PressPercents. But I never have received any more feedback from them yet other than that one job.

Thanks