MBO and Stahl B-20 and B-18 folders

[Al Ferrari]

There are both MBO and Stahl versions of the B-20 and B-18 folders that, mechanically, look extremely similar from one brand to the other. Does anyone know the history of these two lines of machines? Did one company buy the line from the other at some point?

Al Ferrari

 

[ondemandbindery]

Yeah, looking at them you would think the assembly lines go in 2 different directions with different branding all in the same building. I still like the MBO's for one good reason only. The spiral rollers seem to do a good job all the way around. The other reason is the MBO seems more user friendly day in and day out. But I would run either one and if I ran across a golden egg of a deal on a Stahl I would run the snot out of it. Are you curious or in the market?

 

[Al Ferrari]

I am indeed curious about the history, and I am also in the market for a B-20 parallel unit only. Can you please say more about the "more user friendliness" of the MBO?

Thanks,

Al

 

[ondemandbindery]

Sure. I like that the controls are above the machine and not in the way. The pile height control seems to do a better job. I like the plate angles of the MBO though the Stahl 20" may be about the same but I want to say they are steeper. The air separation on the MBO does a better job in my opinion.

At the end of the day I know we have all of this automation on folders for plate setting, guide movements, and so forth. But at the end of the day for me I just want manual plates, minimal electronics, and ease of operation. I ran a T-49 for a few years in a 40" shop. The machine was a beast and I got really good production out of it.

And example of value added in a shop right now is a T-49 on ebay. You can probably get it for 2k or something close to it with right angle. It has the updated pile height sensor on it and if you have the work your ROI won't take long. The one I use to run did not batch but I ran batched work all the time and never had a problem. All about repetitiveness. Let me know if you want to know anything else.

Good luck,

 

[Al Ferrari]

An immense thank you for that tip about the T-49 on ebay. I had already searched ebay for "B-20 and B20" folders without that one showing up. I'll have to scramble for funding now, as I had not planned being ready to buy or to receive a machine for another 60-90 days or so.

One important question: What is that apparent boom over the feeder seeming to hold some element probably to do with the tail of the sheets in the feeder pile? There is Stahl B20 in the shop where I work now and it does not have this boom. On ours, the pile tail stop/hold downs are on each of the pile top side rails that have the drop down sides to keep the air blast from escaping sideways.

[Edit] Is that boom part of a Tremat type rear separation feeder as shown at this new machine link at the MBO America site:http://www.mboamerica.com/t535ea.html?
[end edit]

[Edit 2] I have sent a the question about the possible VACUSTAR rear separation feeder to the seller.[end edit]

Thanks,

Al

 

[ondemandbindery]

The T-49 from MBO has no sheet separation. I guess to help answer some of the question what will the bulk of the work be on this type of machine (size, stock, folds?) As for a Tremat, that is a completely different scenario and a different machine. House much house air (compressed air) is available in your shop? Side air blast at times is your friend on a pilefed.

 

[Al Ferrari]

I have been searching the internet for the last two hours for information related to my feeder question on that T-59 at ebay, and have come to the conclusion that what is pictured on the feeder of that machine is indeed a VACUSTAR rear separation feeder (the MBO equivalent of the Stahl Tremat feeder).

This machine will suit my purpose very well.

Thanks again,

Al

 

[ondemandbindery]

Glad you are looking at options. The T-49 I mentioned that is on Ebay has another interesting twist in that the owner also has an Econocrease available. Before all these fancy scoring collars that we have today came out the Econocrease was the leader of the pack in regards to inline scoring. In fact, I use something similar to it in the shop today.

Good luck,