How to judge paper quality?

[Tradidi]

I started my printing "career" using low end equipment and cheap copy paper. Overall it went well, but due to having a few issues (cold and damp weather setting in, paper curling, ink bleeding, etc..) I am starting to be a little more critical and I am on the lookout for better quality paper that doesn't cost an arm and a leg.

So the question is, how do you asses the quality of paper? Are there some standards and criteria to look out for before purchase? Or is this a matter of experience through trial and error?

Perhaps there are some good books or websites one can go to learn more about the science behind good quality paper?

Pushing my luck even further, where can I find good quality paper in NZ for a reasonable price? Any recommended brands and/or suppliers?

 

[Ynot_UK]

Probably more info. required for a specific answer, so for starters...
Are you listed with any paper merchants?
Not sure what the game is like is NZ, however in Europe, the US, Canada, etc, the norm is to be have accounts with one or more paper merchants. In my experience here in the UK, the reps are extra helpful and will provide swatch books and send out small quantities of sample sheets of various substrate that may be of use, for you to test. Your merchant wants to help make things work for you, as that generates ongoing orders for them. So yes, it can be "trial and error" to some extent, in tandem with an appreciation of a substrate's properties, your print process and capabilities of equipment.

Getting good results depends on many factors at your premises and generally bad results aren't the result of "bad paper". Storage, as you've already touched on, being No.1.

I recall you're the guy printing perfect bound A5 books 1-up on A4, using an MFP, with inkjet covers. Is this still the case, and is this the project you're looking to make improvements to? Correct grain direction may be the most important consideration for you.

 

[SteveSuffRIT]

Paper has both physical and optical properties.
The physical one's effect functionality, runnability, and printability.
These are things important to the printer because they effect productivity and profitability.
The optical properties are about appearance, and more important to the customer, designer. How does it look (and feel).
Brightness is not a good indicator or paper quality!

 

[gordo]

A couple of things to keep in mind about whiteness and brightness: Understanding paper brightness and whiteness

 

[Tradidi]

I recall you're the guy printing perfect bound A5 books 1-up on A4, using an MFP, with inkjet covers. Is this still the case, and is this the project you're looking to make improvements to? Correct grain direction may be the most important consideration for you.

Yes, that's how I started with reasonably good results. I since acquired a Riso ComColor 7150 for the printing, and a Duplo UltraBind 2000 PUR for the binding. But since the winter has started to bite here (cold and damp) I started having issues with the paper, even before printing. One particular brand of paper started warping terribly after 10 minutes out of it's wrapper and this causes not only visual problems but also paper jams in the printer.

Are you listed with any paper merchants?
Not sure what the game is like is NZ, however in Europe, the US, Canada, etc, the norm is to be have accounts with one or more paper merchants. In my experience here in the UK, the reps are extra helpful and will provide swatch books and send out small quantities of sample sheets of various substrate that may be of use, for you to test. Your merchant wants to help make things work for you, as that generates ongoing orders for them. So yes, it can be "trial and error" to some extent, in tandem with an appreciation of a substrate's properties, your print process and capabilities of equipment.

That is my next plan of attack, to seek out a good paper merchant and work with them. I am a bit apprehensive, since I am only a small fish to them and I have seen (in my other business) how small fish often get either ignored or ripped off.

Getting good results depends on many factors at your premises and generally bad results aren't the result of "bad paper". Storage, as you've already touched on, being No.1.

I think I have eliminated all the other factors: I insulated my workshop (walls, ceiling and double glazed windows) and put in a heater and a small dehumidifier. It didn't solve the problem, I assume because there are still fluctuations in temperature and humidity (especially overnight) with which the cheap paper can't cope. I am trying some other brand (only slightly dearer) and so far it looks promising.

 

[Tradidi]

Brightness is not a good indicator or paper quality!

Why would that be?

 

[MacTwidget]

One of the major players in paper distribution here in SoCal holds a seminar called Paper 101 at their distribution center.
I don't know if they still hold the seminar or how frequently they do it.
I took it over a decade ago and I learned more than I ever wanted to know.

 

[joshlindsay]

In NZ we really only have 3 main merchants. BJ Ball, B&F Papers and Spicers. Each have certain brands which they stock.
I mostly use BJ Ball but have recently purchased some stock from Spicers specials list - a really nice Soporset Digital Uncoated.

If I'm shopping for an established quality stock which I can buy over and over again I'd be looking at the following.
Note that I run a FujiFilm Revoria PC1120 so not sure what these will be like with the RISO.

Uncoated
- Advance Laser from BJ Ball - Not a bright white stock but a nice uncoated sheet
- Sapphire Laser from Spicers - Brighter white than Advance Laser

Coated
- Silk Matt from BJ Ball - Super smooth sheet with a good bulk
- Magno Plus Satin from BJ Ball - Not as smooth as Silk but still a nice sheet.
- Impress from Spicers - Nice and smooth but the heaver is made in a different mill I believe and has some different characteristics.

In saying that I'm very much a clearance and special list shopper as many of my clients don't specify a stock. I'll buy pallets of something on special and use it over time.

Moisture is tricky. My shop is in Auckland and we have 2 9kw heatpumps running non stop to try keep the area consistent. Exterior doors are closed. Seems to do pretty good.

 

[Tradidi]

In NZ we really only have 3 main merchants. BJ Ball, B&F Papers and Spicers. Each have certain brands which they stock.

Thank you for the suggestion. I have just contacted BJ Ball and B&F Papers.

 

[Tradidi]

As an aside, is cream colored paper a good option? I personally like the look and feel of it better than white paper, but I wonder whether customers in general prefer white paper, and especially whether the physical qualities are any different from white paper?

 

[SteveSuffRIT]

Why would that be?

Gordo's website does a fine job of explaining the difference.
Brightness is just how much blue light is being reflected. It's an optical property.
Printers care more about how it runs, no feeder trips in sheetfed, no web breaks, no, no jams (digital cutsheet).

 

[Stickman42]

As an aside, is cream colored paper a good option? I personally like the look and feel of it better than white paper, but I wonder whether customers in general prefer white paper, and especially whether the physical qualities are any different from white paper?

About 75% of all the books (these are trade books, not manuals) I produce have cream/natural paper insides. For me it's a matter of customer preference. It's been mentioned to me that it's easier on the eyes compared to a bright white during a long read. The availability of size and weight options is much less than white paper, so you'd have to think through your supply. Plus cream carries a slight upcharge.

 

[Tradidi]

In NZ we really only have 3 main merchants. BJ Ball, B&F Papers and Spicers. Each have certain brands which they stock.
I mostly use BJ Ball but have recently purchased some stock from Spicers specials list - a really nice Soporset Digital Uncoated.

..

Uncoated
- Advance Laser from BJ Ball - Not a bright white stock but a nice uncoated sheet
- Sapphire Laser from Spicers - Brighter white than Advance Laser

..

Moisture is tricky. My shop is in Auckland and we have 2 9kw heatpumps running non stop to try keep the area consistent. Exterior doors are closed. Seems to do pretty good.

I contacted two of these suppliers (B&F and BJ Ball). One of them was the most helpful (B&F), so I went with them and I found a creamy white paper I really like the look and feel of (Wheki Book White), and other people have confirmed that this is nicer than all the other paper they've seen. But.. it goes wavy after a day in my workshop and I don't know how to avoid or fix it. I'm at a complete standstill now, and unless I can resolve this issue, this is the end of the road for me. I don't want to start a new business with a quality issue. A friend/publisher in the US told me that he can see my problem is serious enough that it would concern him as well, as customers can be really hard to deal with and some will complain about anything.

What bothers me is that I do not understand why the hundreds of books in my own personal library don't seem to have that problem, even though they are in the same room. Has time stabilised their paper? Was it better paper to start with?

My friend in the US thought that perhaps there is something in the NZ paper that in the US they don't have, and that causes paper to cockle. But then, I had some books printed in Auckland last year by Lignare and their paper has been flat and with no issues at all. So, either I haven't found the good paper yet or there is something in my workshop or handling that is causing the issue even with good paper. I just can't figure out what it is and how to get around it.

 

[joshlindsay]

Sorry I'm not able to help. Sounds like an environment issue. I came in to my factory on the weekend and saw some jobs left out to be trimmed had gone a bit wavy over the weekend and that's with two heat pumps running constantly - now on dry mode.

I don't think it'd be the paper. It's likely imported from offshore and is likely the same used elsewhere under another name.

 

[Tradidi]

Sounds like an environment issue.

I does look that way. But then other printers must have the same issue as soon as their paper leaves their controlled environment. Or am I missing something?

I came in to my factory on the weekend and saw some jobs left out to be trimmed had gone a bit wavy over the weekend and that's with two heat pumps running constantly - now on dry mode.

That's crazy, in a heavily regulated environment, and you still had issues?

Thanks btw for the replies, they do help me to put this issue in perspective.

 

[PricelineNegotiator]

I would call your paper manufacturers and ask them what you should be doing. They're the right people to ask imo.

 

[Tradidi]

I would call your paper manufacturers and ask them what you should be doing. They're the right people to ask imo.

I have tried that, he did not have any solutions or advice, apart from assuring me that the paper I am using works fine for other printers.

I am in the process of talking to a different supplier.

I also contacted the manufacturer (in Sweden) but so far no reply.

 

[Stickman42]

But.. it goes wavy after a day in my workshop

I've been following your other thread as well. As a fellow book printer that runs both inkjet and toner/laser equipment, I still do not have a complete picture of your product and process.

- what direction is the paper grain? Preferably parallel to the spine of your perfect bound books
- your other thread mentions your books go wavy one day later at your home also. Unless the environments are the same between your shop and home are very similar, I'd rule this out.
- if you open up a ream of paper (I assume you're receiving the paper in reams), cut it to the size of your finished books WITHOUT printing on it, do the waves still occur?
- how much ink coverage is there on your pages? while you do not have a heated fuser as a potential source of the waves, liquid ink in volume could also be contributing to this problem

Fill us in!

 

[Tradidi]

I've been following your other thread as well. As a fellow book printer that runs both inkjet and toner/laser equipment, I still do not have a complete picture of your product and process.

- what direction is the paper grain? Preferably parallel to the spine of your perfect bound books

Yes, paper grain is parallel to the spine. Printing on SRA3 LG, 4 up.

- your other thread mentions your books go wavy one day later at your home also. Unless the environments are the same between your shop and home are very similar, I'd rule this out.

Same environments, both heated when the temperature drops. Work environment has a dehumidifier, which I only run when the air gets really humid.

- if you open up a ream of paper (I assume you're receiving the paper in reams), cut it to the size of your finished books WITHOUT printing on it, do the waves still occur?

Yes, a new ream of paper, when opened up without printing on it, will go wavy overnight when left in my workshop. Although this only happens to the Wheki paper in a short time, other papers go wavy as well but only after a few days or some even take a few weeks. But.. books that I had printed last year and have had in my home for a year now do not go wavy. So paper is definitely a variable. The confusing thing is that paper from a reputable, professional paper merchant has this problem, while "some" standard (i.e. supposedly of lesser quality) A4 copy paper does not, or very minimal.

- how much ink coverage is there on your pages? while you do not have a heated fuser as a potential source of the waves, liquid ink in volume could also be contributing to this problem

Not much ink coverage at all imho. Just large print text, B&W, with many pages empty or half empty.

Fill us in!

My current theory is that this problem has many parameters (paper, temperature, RH, rapid changes in temperature and/or RH, paper handling maybe, ..) and not just one culprit. I just need to find the right combination of parameters that works for me. Some papers need a perfect environment, while others are more forgiving. I have ordered paper from another supplier in the hope that I can find one that is forgiving enough to work with my environment.

Also, a few weeks ago my wife bought a book that was printed locally, and that book was terribly wavy, much more than mine. I don't know whether it was wavy when she bought it in town, or whether it only got wavy once it was in my home for a few days, as I only saw it a few days later.

 

[Stickman42]

So paper is definitely a variable. The confusing thing is that paper from a reputable, professional paper merchant has this problem, while "some" standard (i.e. supposedly of lesser quality) A4 copy paper does not, or very minimal.

This is so true. I run rolls of paper through our high-speed inkjet printer and we chase feeding problems around for a while. Put on a different roll of the same paper and the problem is gone. I've worked with moisture meters, non-contact voltage detectors and paper lab analysis reports trying to achieve the best results. It really is NOT "just" paper.