D&K Europa 5474 Laminator - flying knife vs burst cutter

[Eric Boucher]

Hello,
We are currently running a Tauler Smartmatic 2.0 laminator. Printing on a Konica 3080, mostly SRA3 sheet on 170 gsm coated and 160 gsm uncoated paper. The Tauler machine is working fine, we are just looking at improving paper pick-up (the machine picks up doubles every now and then, we keep having to adjust it) as well as delivery of the laminated sheets (the cutting system seems to put a lot of stress on the paper and create creases and folds in the sheets (we keep having to adjust it as well).

I have looked at the D&K Europa B2 laminator and it seems to be quite a good machine. Sheet feeding looks a lot more "solid" and efficient, as does the "burst" cutting system.

Is anyone running that machine and could pitch in some feedback?

Also, I see it comes either with "burst" type cutting or a flying knife. The reseller tells me the flying knife will only cut Nylon film (which we don't use) and won't work with our type of film (digi-stick Deprosa soft touch and gloss). I can't really see why it wouldn't work with any type of film.. I would think that the knife would eliminate unnecessary stress on the paper when cutting it. Am I wrong?

And lastly, is anyone using it with the foiling option?

Thanks!

 

[aparat]

HI
we have the smaller one (neptune).
Feeding is bullet proof. We load it and go away. The bursting works wery well allso. It is constructed wery good. Not to compare to the foliant that we had before that has bent every paper on the exit.
The flying knife should allso handle all types of laminates, dont see any reason why it should not. The only downside i see on flying knife: as i understand the sheets are not overlaped when using flying knife - so you never have a clean edge on laminated paper like you have with overlaping sheets. clean edge is important for us when the cutting afterwards needs to be very accurate..

We allso have the foilig options and works just great.

 

[Ynot_UK]

We're also a digital SRA3+ operation, with a KM 4080 AccurioPress.
Have a look at the Vivid Matrix Pneumatic systems with OmniFlow deep pile feeder.
We've owned the fully specced Matrix 370DP Duplex with Omniflow and Foiling attachments for coming up one year and have no regrets whatsoever.

• The OmniFlow has handled all the substrates we've given it with ease and wastage is very, very low.
• The Anti-curl on the Matrix is effective and precise - you quickly learn the optimum settings for different substrates, critical in our case as more often than not, the next stage in finishing is digital die cutting, where unwanted curl will wreak havoc.
• The Duplex capability on the Matrix is a massive time saver (and wastage reduction tool) and takes just a few minutes to engage without stripping down, when the machine is already loaded with single sided film on top.
• Whilst we have stuck with Digital OPP films, as much of what we print has heavy toner coverage and full bleed, the pneumatic pressure enables cheaper, non digital films to be used on lighter coverage jobs without risk of de-lamination.
• Foiling is still very early days for us, although the first couple of jobs have been successful, with the loading & setup process pleasantly quick and simple.
• The all-important after sales support and training from Vivid has been first class.

 

[Eric Boucher]

HI
we have the smaller one (neptune).
Feeding is bullet proof. We load it and go away. The bursting works wery well allso. It is constructed wery good. Not to compare to the foliant that we had before that has bent every paper on the exit.
The flying knife should allso handle all types of laminates, dont see any reason why it should not. The only downside i see on flying knife: as i understand the sheets are not overlaped when using flying knife - so you never have a clean edge on laminated paper like you have with overlaping sheets. clean edge is important for us when the cutting afterwards needs to be very accurate..

We allso have the foilig options and works just great.

Hi, thanks for your input. I've talked with D&K and they confirm the flying knife will cut anything. I didn't think of the overlaping issue though, thanks for pointing that out.

 

[Eric Boucher]

We're also a digital SRA3+ operation, with a KM 4080 AccurioPress.
Have a look at the Vivid Matrix Pneumatic systems with OmniFlow deep pile feeder.
We've owned the fully specced Matrix 370DP Duplex with Omniflow and Foiling attachments for coming up one year and have no regrets whatsoever.

• The OmniFlow has handled all the substrates we've given it with ease and wastage is very, very low.
• The Anti-curl on the Matrix is effective and precise - you quickly learn the optimum settings for different substrates, critical in our case as more often than not, the next stage in finishing is digital die cutting, where unwanted curl will wreak havoc.
• The Duplex capability on the Matrix is a massive time saver (and wastage reduction tool) and takes just a few minutes to engage without stripping down, when the machine is already loaded with single sided film on top.
• Whilst we have stuck with Digital OPP films, as much of what we print has heavy toner coverage and full bleed, the pneumatic pressure enables cheaper, non digital films to be used on lighter coverage jobs without risk of de-lamination.
• Foiling is still very early days for us, although the first couple of jobs have been successful, with the loading & setup process pleasantly quick and simple.
• The all-important after sales support and training from Vivid has been first class.

Hi, thanks for your input. I saw your other post and am jealous of your C4080, we got the C3080 just before they introduced it. No major changes I think but they advertise a much higher resolution, does that really make a difference?

We used to have a Matrix 530 for a couple years back in 2013. As far as we're concerned it didn't really perform as expected... Pressure wasn't high enough and even with digital film and high temperatures, we had a lot of silvering. We moved to a Tauler Smartmatic 2.0 which was a great improvement. It has its faults but overall works fine.

I'm also looking at the Duplo PFI Blade so I might hit you up for info since I saw you were running the Veloblade...

Thanks again!

 

[Ynot_UK]

Hi, thanks for your input. I saw your other post and am jealous of your C4080, we got the C3080 just before they introduced it. No major changes I think but they advertise a much higher resolution, does that really make a difference?

We had a demo at KM on a C3070L back in July last year and waited for the C4080.
The clarity and sharpness of the C3070L test prints we made was impressive.
Our C4080 equally so. For most of what we print - training materials and instructional posters - there isn't the very fine detailing to really say it makes a difference. If we were printing high resolution colour photos, that may be different.

We used to have a Matrix 530 for a couple years back in 2013. As far as we're concerned it didn't really perform as expected... Pressure wasn't high enough and even with digital film and high temperatures, we had a lot of silvering.

Was that one of the early models without Pneumatic pressure?
If so, I know of someone else who similarly struggled with an early, non-pneumatic version.
The Pneumatic Matrix is a totally different animal to the early models - rather like comparing the registration on a 10 year old KM C8000 with the C3070/C4080. We have had no silvering issues on our Matrix 370DP and as already eluded to, we print a lot of solid toner coverage which would accentuate any silvering.

 

[Eric Boucher]

Was that one of the early models without Pneumatic pressure?
If so, I know of someone else who similarly struggled with an early, non-pneumatic version.
The Pneumatic Matrix is a totally different animal to the early models - rather like comparing the registration on a 10 year old KM C8000 with the C3070/C4080. We have had no silvering issues on our Matrix 370DP and as already eluded to, we print a lot of solid toner coverage which would accentuate any silvering.

You're right, we didn't have pneumatic pressure, must make a big difference. We're pretty set on the D&K Europa, it looks like a great machine. Test runs we did were perfect.

We dwell in the fine detailed prints I think I'll have KM do some test prints on the 4080 to see if there is a difference. I think maybe we can switch just the engine and upgrade to a 4080 with limited additionnal costs... We had the install in june last year, had no idea the 4080 was coming up when we signed up. The kind of thing they don't tell you.

 

[Ynot_UK]

We dwell in the fine detailed prints I think I'll have KM do some test prints on the 4080 to see if there is a difference. I think maybe we can switch just the engine and upgrade to a 4080 with limited additionnal costs... We had the install in june last year, had no idea the 4080 was coming up when we signed up. The kind of thing they don't tell you.

I understand you could do that, as you would have the latest "-m suffix" components (i.e. PF-707m, RU-518m). No doubt @jwheeler will be able to confirm.

We got unofficial word in the summer that the 40xx machines were developed and would have been launched in Q1/2020 had it not been for Covid, which seemed to follow a trend if you look at the intervals between the 10xx, 20xx and 30xx series.
Initially we were set on securing a 3080 at a heavy discount due to it being end of line, however the remaining European stock shifted quicker than KM anticipated, which is why we then waited an extra couple of months for the 4080.