Oce CS665/KM C6501 Black Replacement Weirdness

[kn4n]

All:

Oce CS665 user here. Basic setup, no frills, Fiery Color Server.

We do alot of our work in AutoCAD, sending RGB image data. We have black replacement turned ON for RGB work right now since it looks better with our gradients.

The problem that I have now is that when we print large flat gray areas with black text or delicate linework on top the text and linework gets really patchy- unreadable in some cases. Not good.

We could go back to a rich black (by turning RGB black replacement off) and it would solve our black lines on flat gray text issues but our gradients would look odd again, with rather distinct pinkish hues.

Any ideas?

Thanks in advance-

kn4n

 

[kn4n]

I haven't checked with other applications (such as InDesign) yet, but part of it may simply be that AutoCAD sucks at handling color, especially gradients.

 

[michaelejahn]

Color Managed conversion ?

Color Managed conversion ?

We could go back to a rich black (by turning RGB black replacement off) and it would solve our black lines on flat gray text issues but our gradients would look odd again, with rather distinct pinkish hues.

Any ideas?

Have you considered creating an RGB PDF and printing that ? Have you considered converting that RGB PDF using something like Enfocus PitStop - using Color Management ?

It sounds to me that you are asking a somewhat primitive RIP to perform this task.

Could you post a PDF for use to review ?

 

[rick_cri]

Try printing with "Point 2" option ON, it is in the drivers options.

 

[kn4n]

Try printing with "Point 2" option ON, it is in the drivers options.

Hi:

Are you referring to the Dot 2 setting in the Windows Printer Driver? Not at work right now so I can't really explore but I will look in the morning.

Thanks for your advice-

kn4n

 

[tppsg]

Pinkish gray is a limitation of the digital device. 4 color gray is a difficult color for digital machines. You can try reducing magenta level on the rip or the machine itself. You can also try to turn on overprint on the rip.

 

[kn4n]

Have you considered creating an RGB PDF and printing that ? Have you considered converting that RGB PDF using something like Enfocus PitStop - using Color Management ?

It sounds to me that you are asking a somewhat primitive RIP to perform this task.

Could you post a PDF for use to review ?

Hi:

We could make PDFs but our workflow doesn't really allow it. (It's the main color printer for a midsize architecture office.) The added steps would make things cumbersome for us. Ideally, the prints would come out right without having to add steps or involving our IT/Printing specialist (me).

kn4n

 

[Steve_S]

kn4n-

We're an Oce cs665 user - can you post a sample PDF, maybe just with a problem gray patch with type over it? We have some good gray work arounds but some of it depends on the file. Either email me or post a pdf to the forum and I'll see if I can give you any tips.

 

[kn4n]

PDF post

PDF post

All:

A sample PDF with the problem area outlined in a heavy black line is attached.

This is our setup (for RGB)

Rip: External Fiery Controller.
RGB Profile: Fiery RGB V5/Photographic
Gray and Black Replacement: On for Text/Graphics/Images

Any assistance would be appreciated. I've also posted a file with the gradient I mentioned previously that looks so much better with the black replacement on.

I suppose one option is to create a separate AutoCAD print setting for files with gradients in them but I would really prefer not to. Given the way we work it would be far preferable to get one best setting to minimize the hassle involved.

Thanks.

Kn4n

 

[Steve_S]

Are you printing using a print driver, dropping on a hot folder, or uploading the files through the Fiery?

 

[kn4n]

Are you printing using a print driver, dropping on a hot folder, or uploading the files through the Fiery?

We are using a print driver, straight from AutoCAD.

 

[Steve_S]

We don't have AutoCAD, so I cannot help you there. We also have CREO color servers on our Oce's. Printing your file through the print driver from Acrobat, the output here is smooth, crisp and readable. We do not use black replacement and our standard RGB profile is set to AdobeRGB1998. I don't know many of the settings on the Fiery, so some of the other users on the forum might have to help with that. There is a "Smooth Gradients" feature on the CREO that we use frequently - you might check to see if that is on the Fiery somewhere. Wish I had more useful info for you...

 

[kn4n]

We don't have AutoCAD, so I cannot help you there. We also have CREO color servers on our Oce's. Printing your file through the print driver from Acrobat, the output here is smooth, crisp and readable. We do not use black replacement and our standard RGB profile is set to AdobeRGB1998. I don't know many of the settings on the Fiery, so some of the other users on the forum might have to help with that. There is a "Smooth Gradients" feature on the CREO that we use frequently - you might check to see if that is on the Fiery somewhere. Wish I had more useful info for you...

SnappySteve:

OK thanks. We will keep exploring here.

kn4n