Did anyone ask for your input?

[jbeniston]

So we're going to buy a new offset press.

How many pressmen were asked to get involved or have some input. Did anyone ask what extra equipment might be required to make your job easier or was it left up to the Tea Lady in the canteen or the one who serves Chips(French fries to our Amareican cousins) and beans in the refectory. Is the whole deal left to people who would not know the difference between a sheet of paper and a chunk of pig iron.

Printing Presses are very expensive items and seems to require a lot of time and effort to make the purchase.
How many pressmen are asked or get involved on the process and how well are they listened too.

I'm just curious.

 

[agmfan3]

Even I was involved and I'm just the lowly typesetter! My Pressman was involved as well as me. Sure made the process a lot easier.

 

[Dottiek]

So we're going to buy a new offset press.

How many pressmen were asked to get involved or have some input. Did anyone ask what extra equipment might be required to make your job easier or was it left up to the Tea Lady in the canteen or the one who serves Chips(French fries to our Amareican cousins) and beans in the refectory. Is the whole deal left to people who would not know the difference between a sheet of paper and a chunk of pig iron.

Printing Presses are very expensive items and seems to require a lot of time and effort to make the purchase.
How many pressmen are asked or get involved on the process and how well are they listened too.

I'm just curious.

In my case when our lease was out, I did the research, the comparisons, talked to the sales reps and the techs, made my recommendations with the reasons, then was overruled by the Educator who concocted the analysis graphs to fit what he thought the higher-ups wanted to hear. I reserved and used the right to say "I told you so" when things hit the fan. I can get away with it because I am the only one who knows how the entire print process works here and I can be quite blunt when necessary.
That's better than the school I spoke with where an "expert analyst" was brought in to evaluate and recommend and the inplant employees were given no consultation at all. That system still isn't working 2 years later.
I think not confering with knowledgable staff is a common problem in not only printing, but every other industry across the board. I don't know what the big secret is. Aren't we all trying to get a job done with the least amount of pain?

 

[onwsk8r]

The shop I work at now is good about consulting, doing due diligence, etc, and consequently has very little equipment related problems.

The shop I used to work at was run by a "production optimization expert" who didn't bother to ask questions, etc. You can always tell an "expert" from an expert because "experts" don't need to ask questions, whereas experts ask them constantly. He made all the purchasing decisions himself, which is funny when you consider he was the ONLY - the single, lone employee that didn't know anything about printing. Consequently, there were certain things we were just extremely bad at. There were certain jobs we just really couldn't do, there were certain tasks that were extremely time consuming for really no reason, but most of all, we were paying out THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS PER MONTH unnecessarily. I think at one point I figured out I could save the company roughly USD$2500/month without them actually having to spend any money. We got most of our supplies from the most expensive vendor (ie ULine, Xpedx). We ran into bizarre problems that nobody could solve frequently. The employees felt alienated and disconnected. Customers would complain and people would be tempted to say it's Not... My... Fault... (Sorry if you read this buddy, but it's the truth!)

The bottom line is that your production employees know the company better than anyone else - especially the tenured ones. Some years ago, I was working for a company that brought in a consultant. The consultant spent the first week sitting, watching, and writing in a notebook. Periodically he would ask a question or two, or maybe move around to get a better vantage point, but was otherwise a wallflower. I'd say 90%+ of his suggestions were accepted by everyone.

Not to threadjack, but can we change the question to how many printers that are still in business get employee input before making purchases, and how many printers that are out of business did not?

 

[john beniston]

Sure, go right ahead. It will be interesting to see what the answers contain don't you think. So far as I can tell right now it's about 50/50 regarding who and who was not involved on the process to decide on which or what press to purchase.
How do people who know nothing about printing, the history of it or its effect on the population in all countries., get high paying jobs in upper management. I have seen that too.
There are very good managers who openly admit that they no nothing about printing but do know how to run a business expertly. I know this because I worked for one. He told us all at a meeting that he knew nothing about our industry at all. His methods sorted the garbage out and made the company one of the top 5 label houses in Europe.
However I think he was an exception to the general rule.

 

[Captain Kirk]

In my case when our lease was out, I did the research, the comparisons, talked to the sales reps and the techs, made my recommendations with the reasons, then was overruled by the Educator who concocted the analysis graphs to fit what he thought the higher-ups wanted to hear. I reserved and used the right to say "I told you so" when things hit the fan. I can get away with it because I am the only one who knows how the entire print process works here and I can be quite blunt when necessary.
That's better than the school I spoke with where an "expert analyst" was brought in to evaluate and recommend and the inplant employees were given no consultation at all. That system still isn't working 2 years later.
I think not confering with knowledgable staff is a common problem in not only printing, but every other industry across the board. I don't know what the big secret is. Aren't we all trying to get a job done with the least amount of pain?

LOL...I know EXACTLY what you're saying. My manager (1.5 years in the biz) is meeting with our copier vendor as i'm typing to discuss configuration and component choices. Considering we do 25 million + per year on 6 1107's, you'd think the production coordinator would be involved.

 

[porterman]

not at all,in fact,my input was ignored as to where to place the press.(closer to the sink). so now,when my hands get dirty or i need to wash something,i have to walk across the plant to get to the sink that was placed there thirty years ago for that very purpose(for the copy gal to wash things and her hands before handling paper) this is in a bulk mailing plant and the printing was separated from us in the building about 20 years ago. now,with all the layoffs,its become one of my new dutys. im originally a mailing mechanic but have had to take over printing dutys as they laid off all the press guys about 7 years ago and the lone one they kept moved on. have an old 9850 and 9870 ab dick to fool with.

 

[Rickyo]

Company I worked for never ask press operators and cost them mega bucks in long run ,just shook my head n took pay check

 

[turbotom1052]

There is a disturbing trend in our industry as of the last 15 or so years for companies to do away with a properly trained "pressroom supervisor". Ive seen it pretty often, that the "pressroom supervisor" is a re assigned pre press guy, or production guy, or in the worst case scenario, the bosses nephew who just graduated with his bachelors in graphic design. When you consider the fact that the pressroom, in most all commercial printing plants is the highest cost center by far, it boggles the mind that any company owner wouldn't want their highest cost center manned by a fully competent pressroom pro, that has experience in the trenches. This should be the guy that's being asked the technical questions and conferred with. In the frequent absence of such a guy, it would only make sense to turn to the best of your pressman. I believe this mentality comes from the thinking on upper managements part, that if you just invest all your money is the highest tech equipment, you will wind up with presses that even a cave man can run. Much of this mentality comes from the press manufacturers that sell their equipment based on this very common "sales pitch".