eps files?

[wonderings]

We had an issue pop up, where a file from a design house had the exact same logo on top of itself. Solid colour so I would not really think anything of it (coming from indesign). The way my co-worker works is by using .eps, she does manuel imposition with these jobs. She likes to convert to .eps, and then impose the .eps files. We have never had an issue with files she has prepared this way in the past, but in this case the double image was a problem. It looked like the image had shifted up and one was pixelated like it had a missing link, which it did not.

Now when trying to figure out where the problem lie, I went through with the customers, untouched original files and did it her way, then mine using pdf. Making a pdf had the file come out perfect.

I know .eps files are not really used anymore, but what concrete reasons can I give to say no more .eps files? I have only been in pre press about 6 or 7 years so have plenty to learn, but I am already more fluent in all the apps we use and need to go over her files to check things are right. My exact understanding of .eps is limited, but I know I only use .ai files, psd or pdf depending on where things are coming from.

 

[Greg_Firestone]

Hi wonderings,

There are quite a few advantages. For starters, the EPS format is no longer being developed. All efforts are in PDF. For this reason, there are many capabilities in PDF which are not available in EPS.

General Benefits
- You can view a PDF with several different viewers (Acrobat, Preview, etc). There are only a few apps which can open EPS files and display them (excluding Illustrator which is not recommended for external files for a host of other reasons).
- PDFs have greater compression opportunities for smaller files
- EPS's cannot support transparency or layers, newer PDFs can
- Device N support in PDF
- Smooth shading in PDF
- Embedding of Double-Byte Fonts
- Object level metadata
- Trim Box, Crop Box, Media Box, Bleedbox in PDF
- Easier to preflight (more PDF preflight tools than EPS)

Long story short, if you have a newer workflow, you should be able to obtain higher quality output through your RIPs by using PDF workflow.

Regards,
Greg

 

[Al Ferrari]

How would you respond to a Quark using designer that responds to your suggestion to use pdf instead of eps by pointing out that Quark does not accept pdf for import or placement?

Al

 

[MacTwidget]

How would you respond to a Quark using designer that responds to your suggestion to use pdf instead of eps by pointing out that Quark does not accept pdf for import or placement?

Al

That is no longer true with the latest versions of QuackXPress.

 

[leonardr]

How would you respond to a Quark using designer that responds to your suggestion to use pdf instead of eps by pointing out that Quark does not accept pdf for import or placement?

Tell them to switch to InDesign, of course .

 

[Al Ferrari]

She tried it back with ID 2 and decided to stay with Quark. I can pass her contact info to you and you can sell her on ID. I certainly would welcome that.

Al

 

[davidmwe]

FlightCheck for EPS

FlightCheck for EPS

All PDFs are not created equally. PDF's look the same on the desktop, Illustrator PDF or not, even if "preserve Illustrator editing capabilities" is turned on when generating it (one reason to use a stand-alone preflight app, nudge, nudge). The advantages of EPS from the creators side, in a nut-shell are:

* Flattened content - when placed in InDesign, Quark, wherever used the data is flattened
* Un-flattened artwork in native Illustrator format within the same EPS, so if you re-open in Illustrator you have the vector based artwork and fonts as needed
* Many graphic designers only save-as a .EPS file when the logo or design is ***final***
(Can you imagine the horror when a designer _flattens_ their ONLY copy of the native .AI file?!?! So workflow is a part of why many use a .EPS over a .PDF)

With native Illustrator (ai) files now being able to be ***dangerously*** placed within InDesign layout files (InDesign preflight does not see them, nor does it package them or the used fonts or images if the file was not flattened! FlightCheck does BTW), you can see that slowly the market is moving away from EPS files. This is only an observation, for EPS is still widely used and until the native format can be more readily and securely used, it is still the safest route for many on the creative side. Yes, placing a PDF is possible and used more and more, but we are back to my first sentence again - it has to feel right and look right for a designer.

Friendly Regards,
David
Markzware

 

[Greg_Firestone]

The way my co-worker works is by using .eps, she does manuel imposition with these jobs. She likes to convert to .eps, and then impose the .eps files.

I should have asked this before. What are you and your coworker imposing in? Quark, Indesign, or a dedicated Imposition solution (e.g. Preps, Speedflow Impose, Dynastrip). And what output format is she using after imposing?

Greg

 

[RUsure]

Make sure the designer recognizes the possibility of brain fade (unheard of in the prepress industry). The logo (or whatever) could have been placed on a Master layer and/or on an active/hidden layer creating an odd/mis-match version scenario . . .
The points expressed by @davidmwe do address the "creative" side's views/habits . . .

 

[John W]

Eps survives.

Eps survives.

If the job has been built incorrectly (this happens to us 70-80% of the time), a native file or an editable eps is superior to pdf to alter if the alterations are extensive, eg, wrong die shape, bad imagery resolution, wrong coloring, no overwrap, no tolerances, bad bleed, "please make a green sample from a brown one; change the logo to our new version; make the job both flexo and litho compatible", etc.
The beauty of a flattened eps, once it is correct, it will always rip properly. Once it reaches the printer, we argue it should be correct and therefore does not have to maintain its transparency. In fact we flatten everything before the rip since devices after the rip are all flat file compatible. That's when you will see any trouble. With pdf, you may not see the trouble until it's far too late.
For some types of work, pdf is the way to go. But not all types of work. We often get files from Europe which use a different diecutting system than ours so all the files must be rebuild nearly from scratch to fit for exmple, North American diecutting equipment. Fulfilling set ups vary even more and require mods to the file to maintain high speed filling machines. Few clients know or care what is done as long as the job is correct and works all the way to the consumer shelf. Eps helps achieve that by reducing unknowns.
John W

 

[mojoprime]

@davidmwe -- i package files with .ai files all the time without an issue. i've never had a printer or other let me know there's an issue; over the course of several years and multiple print shops, it seems like someone would have said something if there was an issue.

is this a known issue? sorry. just trying to get a handle on this. i mean, we place .ai files in all of our indesign documents, though 90% of the time now we only send PDFs to the printer.

 

[davidmwe]

Does InDesigns Package collect Illustrator links

Does InDesigns Package collect Illustrator links

@davidmwe -- i package files with .ai files all the time without an issue. i've never had a printer or other let me know there's an issue; over the course of several years and multiple print shops, it seems like someone would have said something if there was an issue.

is this a known issue? sorry. just trying to get a handle on this. i mean, we place .ai files in all of our indesign documents, though 90% of the time now we only send PDFs to the printer.

Hi, this particular issue in this video:

Does InDesigns Package collect Illustrator links - FlightCheck v6.80 does - YouTube