Evo - missing half tones

[WLprinter]

Hi,

I need some help please.
We recently installed an update (5.1.6.5) as we were having problems with missing transparencies. Unfortunately, this has caused an intermittent problem. Every now and then, the half tones and lower disappear from the yellow plate (this is the last plate out of a set). Once the problem starts, all following yellow plates will be missing half tone unless we re-start EVO. We have tried restarting all other part in the process – Brisque and our LOTEM but only when we restart EVO does the problem go.

We run EVO and HARMONY for the curve. We can go 2 or 3 weeks some times without this occurring. Other times it happens a few days in a row. Its causing havoc. Kodak cannot sort. They have checked the TIFF files of the bad plates that EVO produced and they say they look fine so they say it may not be EVO but it is only when we restart EVO that the problem goes.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Regards Toby.

 

[james.bredenhof]

Hi Toby,
Can you elaborate on what you mean by "the half tones and lower disappear"? Do you mean you get incorrect halftone dots (if so, what shape/frequency are they?), or that 0-50% tints are blown out, or....?
James

 

[WLprinter]

Blown out

Blown out

Hi James,

Thanks for taking the time to reply.

50% tone is almost completely blown out. It is very noticeable from the colour bars - the 50% colour bar is virtually invisible.

Tones below are completely gone.

Regards Toby.

 

[james.bredenhof]

Okay, I see what you mean with "half tone". Interesting usage of the term.

I assume you're using the Brisque as a TIFF shooter to the Lotem?
If you want to isolate the problem yourself,
1) I'd recommend capturing some of the TIFF files. Image a Yellow plate correctly, and keep the corresponding TIFF on file.
2) When the problem reoccurs, keep the TIFF, and take a look at it (on Brisque, or in Photoshop or whatever).
3) Then re-image the known-good TIFF that you imaged in step 1 and see what you get. This will tell you if the problem is in the TIFF generation (Evo) or imaging (Brisque/Lotem).

It sounds like the Response Center already did this, and determined that the TIFFs are fine, which to me would imply an imaging problem... although that would itself be very curious.

 

[WLprinter]

Just go this from Kodak

Just go this from Kodak

Hi,

recieved this this am.

Hello Toby,
Just to let you know we had the TIFF files Peter took away with him analyzed by our Product Support department in Brussels and they cannot find any problem with them.
Their recommendation is the problem may be coming from the communication between the Brisque and Lotem
The screenshot below indicates the correct 35% tint value in the colour bar of the TIFF which is not seen on the plate.
Best regards
Mark

He has attached a graphic of the tiff but i cannot attach it is seems.

To which i replied:

I Mark,

Thanks.

Can you ask them how is it that the problem only clears when we restart EVO?
We restart Brisque and it makes no difference.
We restart the LOTEM and it makes no difference.

Regards Toby

 

[james.bredenhof]

okay. their response sounds logical. The nice thing about a TIFF based connection like you have, is that you can see the pixels in the file, which is this case are fine.

Try step #3 above.

 

[WLprinter]

Hi,

Sorry, please bear with me, I not really a studio person, my studio manager left a few months ago and we are getting by with out so I need to make this as simple as possible.

Please see answers below.

I assume you're using the Brisque as a TIFF shooter to the Lotem? YES
If you want to isolate the problem yourself,

1) I'd recommend capturing some of the TIFF files. Image a Yellow plate correctly, and keep the corresponding TIFF on file.

DO YOU MEAN KEEP IT ON THE BRISUE? What I am thinking is when we next have a bad plate we could then re-plate an earlier good yellow plate from the brisque??

2) When the problem reoccurs, keep the TIFF, and take a look at it (on Brisque, or in Photoshop or whatever).

KODAK have had a look at a few and they all seem fine.

3) Then re-image the known-good TIFF that you imaged in step 1 and see what you get. This will tell you if the problem is in the TIFF generation (Evo) or imaging (Brisque/Lotem).

As 1 – do we send from Brisque again?

Cheers Toby

 

[james.bredenhof]

DO YOU MEAN KEEP IT ON THE BRISUE? What I am thinking is when we next have a bad plate we could then re-plate an earlier good yellow plate from the brisque??

Yes, exactly.
what you'll need to do is figure out how the files get from Prinergy to the Brisque hot folder (look at the file path in the Prinergy Process Template).
when the system is behaving properly, temporarily change the output destination to a "cold folder" on Prinergy or the Brisque (precise location doesn't matter, as long as you can find it later on). Make a note of this file, since you'll want to keep it (known good file). Manually copy the file from the cold folder into the hot folder. Make sure the output is correct.

2) When the problem reoccurs, keep the TIFF, and take a look at it (on Brisque, or in Photoshop or whatever).

KODAK have had a look at a few and they all seem fine

Okay, so this implies that the files are good, and the problem is ocurring in the Brisque/Lotem. This seems to contradict your observation that only a restart of Prinergy makes a difference. I'm not sure what to make of this.

3) Then re-image the known-good TIFF that you imaged in step 1 and see what you get. This will tell you if the problem is in the TIFF generation (Evo) or imaging (Brisque/Lotem).

As 1 – do we send from Brisque again?

Yes, when the system is behaving improperly, go back to the known-good file, and again manually copy it into the Brisque hot folder. This will tell you whether the Brisque/Lotem part of the chain is working correctly.

 

[WLprinter]

Thanks James.

Thanks James.

Will keep you posted. Cheers T

 

[Stew]

I got the same kind of response from kodak for a screening problem too. As it turns out it was a bad cable - whatever diagnostics was Kodak used didn't solve the problem including checking tiffs. This went on for months and months with lots of production down time.

When I had a connection problem it was the same response from Kodak for that as well:
http://printplanet.com/forums/kodak-systems/26130-prinergy-down-again-etc-whats-up-kodak-support

 

[WLprinter]

thanks

thanks

Thanks for taking the time to reply.

WE are still having on going problems but less often.

Some Black plates where missing half tones about 2 weeks ago.

All very strange.

we are about to move so will change cable at same time.

will keep you posted.

Cheers Toby

 

[och_och]

try to turn off your server antivirus...