Feeding 24" preprinted shells

[kevneto]

We have a huge job (monthly) that requires us to imprint variable data (just black text) on a 11" x 24" 80# gloss cover, perfed and scored, pre-printed sheet.

Does anyone know of a B & W printer with faster speeds that can handle this sheet size and weight?

This first run I have to print them on 6 HP 8150 printers. It will pass the 24" sheet straight through, but only will print on the first 17" from the leading edge, which the design does accommodate. So I can fulfill the job, but it will be a soul crusher!

Just looking for better options. Any help will be appreciated.

Kev

 

[WharfRat]

We do it on an iGEN 4 - 26.00 x 14.33
but
we have an awesome contract and the thing runs constantly
with good paying jobs.

MSD

 

[kevneto]

Thanks WharfRat

I did bring that option up to the boss knowing the paper handling capabilities of the IGen. It seems crazy to run preprinted sheets through a high end press like an Igen. The perfs, scores and inks would have to cause havoc with the machine.

We currently have a Nexpress and the Kodak sales person suggested upgrading to the SX version which can also do a 14 x 26 sheet for this job. Though, I just can't imagine Kodak being too happy when we start eating image and blanket cylinders like crazy if we ran this stuff through it.

Crazy sale people. They'll say anything to make a sale! ;-)

 

[mac_man_luke]

A few konica machines will do it but you can only use the bypass feeder with minimal capacity.

 

[OkiTech]

Hi OKI engine can image a banner 12x47 I think. It is a color printer but not expensive one and have by-pass capacity 2x higher than your HPs and have a descent speed. But I would advice you to try before you buy - OKis are prone to lay a slight background on glossy stocks so if your shells are glossy - it may not be the best option. Besides printing business we're Office equipment dealer for 10+ years and I am trying to think of the machine that can do what you need and cost less than half a million and sadly there are not to many options, nothing at all that could think of that would have a high capacity paper tray capable of taking 24 inch paper and there is nothing at all. If I would have to run this job, I'd line up 2-4 Okis and have 1 person operate... I guess

 

[Joe Duffy]

Is it a must that it is done with toner? Epson has several inkjets that are capable of running this and do not cost an arm and a leg.

 

[OkiTech]

Joe, don't you think Ink-Jet Epson would be way to slow for production environment? I mean if they have over 10,000 - 20,000 pieces to print - it will be time to retire when inkjet epson gets done with 20000 pieces of whatever

 

[Joe Duffy]

No limitations on the size, and if it is text then 360 dpi would be fine.

 

[curveto]

Keep it in America! (at least in part)

Heavy Stock Multi-Media Digital Press | Xanté Ilumina Printers, Consumables and more. | xante.com

http://www.xante.com/non-cms-assets/xante-brochures/iluminaGSseries/IGS Series Spec LR.pdf

 

[Joe Duffy]

Please do not recomend that to him. I have one of these now and would not recomend it for any type of high volume work. The cost per print is way out of line and the speed is not that great either... and if you have any curl on the sheet feeding is a pain.

I stated the Epson line because you can get a 24" engine and print only 11" deep, and fairly quickly. For the price of the Xante you can get 2 Epsons and a RIP - and your cost per proof would be less than 110th of the Xante.

 

[X33]

Thanks WharfRat

I did bring that option up to the boss knowing the paper handling capabilities of the IGen. It seems crazy to run preprinted sheets through a high end press like an Igen. The perfs, scores and inks would have to cause havoc with the machine.

I would ask Xerox to run some tests. I'm not an iGen expert but if I remember correctly, the way the xerographics work on the iGen allow it to run "crazy" stocks. I think there's something specifically about the way the toner is transferred on to the paper...

 

[OkiTech]

Well yes, Xante is expensive. But it can pump 40 b/w LTR sizes per minute how fast is epson?
Guy has 10,000 pcs of something.... Oki ES3640 or C9800 has the same engine as Xante and frankly you can, most likely, buy 2 okis for the price of Xante, just about... And black ink isn't all that expensive. Facing this situation I'd get 3 nice used OKI's in a row, just to get started, it would cost about $5000 give or take $500 and while not printing this job, would be able to print many other things... Drums and toners are periodically available on Ebay with great discounts so buying ahead whenever something there would save the whole bunch, there are some descent aftermarket toners as well for 1/4 of the cost of OEM. There is a way to do this so-so in timely manner, farely efficiently and profitably without buying Igen or any other Near-Million machines. I have great respect for Epson - awesome quality posters, proofs, etc. but pushing 10,000 pcs of B/W work on 6 or 8 colors ink jet printer - I don't think so guys.
Even Oki or any other color printer seems like an overshoot but I own Printing shop and Copier/Printer service company so I am around printers all day long and can't think of B/W device that can do this... HP LaserJet M9040 may be but if job is coverstock, it will be extremely unhappy.

 

[Joe Duffy]

UnlimitedBT, maybeyou have some info that is not posted or are making an assumption that I am not. His print size is 11 x 24, not 8 1/2 x 11 so the 40 ppm you mention is not applicable and also that requires a huge amount of drum life and transfer belt life on the Oki engine printers you mention. You again mention 10,000 sheets, I have never seen that on this post, and if the job is 10,000 then why are they shells? The Epson solution is cheap, easy and very simple. I would buy the Epson service and run the life out of the printers and printing 11" they are very quick and he would have no limit on what or where the copy is. It would only use Black inks if he was just sending black and would allow him to print color if needed. He also can purchase used products and discounted ink solutions on-line but would void the warranty. Just my 2 cents worth.

 

[OkiTech]

I posted 40 ppm as industry standard for measuring printing speed sure running 24" long will be slower but so will be every other device...

 

[kevneto]

Hi all,

Thanks for your input. Some good suggestions that I'll be researching.

We did run the job on 7- HP8150's and got it done. Took about 36 hours with 1 person per machine to prevent double feeds and keep fanning the paper to break it apart. Labor intensive to be sure and a soul-crusher!

The only benefit of the 8150's is that I buy all the parts and can service them here on the spot, which was helpful during this run. The Okidata seems interesting as it would get me better paper handling, larger print area and better fusing, but need to look into consumables and service.

This 80,000 11 x 24 is a monthly job we just brought on, so I'll still be looking for solutions.

Thanks for all your help.

 

[Happyprinter]

Have to agree with Joe, Xante is NOT the machine to handle this job. Very unreliable and as stated earlier, leaves a background tint on gloss no matter what you do to try and fix it. Unlimited BT is right, not to many options that are inexpensive!

 

[OkiTech]

Assuming that you will send jobs as b/w it should consume black toners only. Even with aftermarket Oki will give you better quality and better paper handling and all consumables are widely available from internet as well as from Ebay - I can advise you sellers who's toners I had used without any problems. Also HP LaserJet 9000 series is far more robust printer than 8150 and parts/maintenance is just about the same easy as 8150. Please research HP LaserJet M9040 MFP if you think it may fit your set-up - We have one for sale and can get 3-5 more at descent price. Let me know.
Roman.

 

[Hightower]

Printing 24" with MGI could be an alternative...

Printing 24" with MGI could be an alternative...

Hi Kevneto, MGI might be solution. It should be able to handle 24" with speed of 1200 /hr and since there is no "click", low coverage personalization would be reasonable also cost wise.

 

[OkiTech]

Yeah, an MGI is awesome machine.
There are 2 problems with it:
#1) $300,000 price tag where entire topic is dedicated to "get the job done and not spend the fortune".
#2) MGI took an $35,000 KM-C6500 (Wholesale cost of which is most likely around $25,000) beefed it up and sells it for whooping 10x more expensive. AMG who is charging $45K to make a rocket out of $120K MB Benz S600 can take a rest LOL.

 

[Hightower]

Cost matters or does it?

Cost matters or does it?

We did run the job on 7- HP8150's and got it done. Took about 36 hours with 1 person per machine to prevent double feeds and keep fanning the paper to break it apart. Labor intensive to be sure and a soul-crusher!