Did the backline for the Platedriver (remember them Eskopodi?) the 5mw violet was crap however the 10mw did everything you asked even on the western digital´s.
Much cheaper too and lasting far longer than the Thermals.
nshadab,
Steve brought up a good point in that the plate has to be able to meet your needs so that should be one of your factors to help determine what CtP you would need. A couple general comments. There are basically three version of imaging technology, flatbed, internal drum and external drum. I will not comment on flatbed in that we do not sell that technology. For violet, the Prosetter is internal drum. With our optics and 10 micron spot size, we were able to go up to 300 line screen and 20 micron FM. On the Suprasetter, it is external drum. Most thermal was/is external drum to maximize the heat transfer. The closer the laser to the plate, the more efficient the system. This is also why I mentioned distance of the optical path, the shorter the path, the more efficient the thermal laser is. Many people commented on the long life of the violet laser. The laser is only on when imaging plates so when you are not imaging, you are not putting any wear and tear on the laser. With the Suprasetter laser, it too is only on when imaging a plate. Some lasers are on when the CtP is turned on and therefore the laser is degrading even though you are not imaging. A few other points to consider, does the ctp have internal punching capabilities? This will be more consistent then an offline punch and will reduce press make ready. You may also want to look at automation, what is the footprint, how many plates does it hold, does it automatically remove slipsheets? I would also take into consideration the environmental specification, what is the operating range. Hope this helps.
Regards,
Mark
Mark is right, but I have some comments:
1- For Thermal Lasers there are up to 15 minutes warm up time before starting the image process(waiting time). This is when the laser starts turning on for imaging process . Laser hours and Lasers being off haven't improved the life of Thermal lasers in many cases 2- The Lasers can't get too close to the Plate or it isn't up to service Tech to install it as close as possible to the Plates( There are factory set up and optic bed designed for exact installation location of the Laser with some distance tolerances to Drum as first the beam has to be seen by BCM 3- There are focus and Auto focus Issues which the lenses should be in a right distance from the plate in order for the beam to hit the right spot on the Plates and the problems associated with Thermal lasers specially for external drums 4- The GLV calibration for every 21, 41 or.. plates and the corrupted profiles.5- The non-sense story of the plate's quality with SQUARE Spot Technology all are associated with Thermal lasers. However, the Infrared(Thermal) technology is improving and the future is toward That Technology.
I would really like to hear Mark, Kalvin and Steve to provide us with some information about their effective after sales and support provided by their companies for both Technologies. I would also like to know how well and fast their Service Personnel look after the Machines and protect customers' investment.
Regards,
violet
Farshad
Hi Farshad,
With all due respect, the Suprasetter laser is different then what you are stating below. Here is a quote from an article Andrew Tribute wrote on CtP for the last Drupa. This was posted on Whattheythink.com:
" Heidelberg’s Suprasetter, the CtP engine with probably the most advanced thermal imaging technology has substantially increased its market position and it introduced a number of new larger and faster engines at drupa."
I do beleive we have the newest thermal laser technology in the CtP world.
1- The Suprasetter thermal laser does not have a step down/stand by mode that requires a 15 minute warm up time, when you image a plate, it is instananously on, when done imaging, it is off. And the laser is not on when you turn the machine on; it is not degrading just because the CtP is turned on. As I stated, like violet, the laser is only on when imaging plates. So there is a major difference comparing to other thermal lasers techologies. As an example, our demo Surpasetter was on for 9,152 hours but the laser imaging time was only 733 hours with plate imaging being instantaneous.
2- I am a bit confused by your statements on external drum. I go back to the Hell Scanners days. In the 1970's, Dr. Hell released the first laser generated dot with the DC300 A Scanner. We were using a Argon-ion Laser to expose film on an external drum back then . When Heidelberg acquired Linotype-Hell, they also acquired many patents and knowledge of high end imaging. Back then as well as now, the laser is mounted and then fine tuned by our service techs when installing the CtP. Internal drum works well for violet and external for thermal. I do not know what a BCM is.
3-We designed the Suprasetter laser with a very deep depth of focus so that an autofocus mechanism is not required. We also do not have any moving parts such as autofocus in our laser, not one. If dust gets on the exposing drum, this also reduces hotspots or compensates for irregular plates. All of this leads to a very small laser system...actually I carry one in my computer bag, the complete laser measures about 4 1/4" deep by 2 5/8" wide by 2 3/8" tall. I challenge anyone else to carry their complete thermal laser in their computer bag(ok, a regular size computer bag, not a duffel bag
4- The Suprasetter laser is not GLV technology, it is "Individually Addressable Bar" (IAB Laser Array) with 64 individually addressable laser beams without calibration problems. I do not know what you mean by corrupted profiles.
5- No, we do not use the Square Spot story in reference to our laser and we do only offer one high quality thermal laser rated up to 400 line screen.
I can only speak for service in the US, our technicians service our violet Prosetters and our thermal Suprasetters and legacy thermal Topsetters.
Best regards,
Mark Tonkovich
More of an emotional reaction of the above I would like to remind this person Farshad that he ultimately does the same thing as Mark but worse, in emphasizing his expertise trying to promote his business. I find the tone of Farshad's reply quite insulting. For what it's worth I am simply a watcher, in no way connected to Mark Tonkovich or Heidelberg.
Very well said...
Why not only VIOLET v/s THERMAL....
i think thats what we are discussing here....lol
More of an emotional reaction of the above I would like to remind this person Farshad that he ultimately does the same thing as Mark but worse, in emphasizing his expertise trying to promote his business. I find the tone of Farshad's reply quite insulting. For what it's worth I am simply a watcher, in no way connected to Mark Tonkovich or Heidelberg.
Yes, he made some good point here.-
i am going to start with production house (plate processors house) in india. so with my research i opted for thermal...and looking for either kodak or Heidelberg. i still have to workout on both which one is better and cost effective.
Dear Nshadab,
you are planning to start process house,the good choice will be ctcp. pl have a look On Ctcp from CRON and it is reliable and reasonably fair price.this equipment comes with 2,00,000 plates warranty on laser diodes.
if you need further information pl contact me.
v.srinivasa babu.
0091-9848090464
hi all experts,
do you want to say something about CTCP?
i dont think, it can compete with either thermal or violet...
Dear All,
you can try to send some file to me, i will expose on normal ps plate ,same file you can try with thermal plates and you can both print in one off-set m/c and see the difference.This Cron ctcp is external drum base and can produce up to 2800 dpi.If you can not do this , i will provide some big offset printers names with telephone nos, who have conducted this comparison exercise and satisfied with the results.
Babu.
Perfect! Good to have you here Gordo!@ Babu, If you do such a test comparing different CtPs, you might want to order the plates imaged as suggested, then wait a month and request a new magenta plate from each of the vendors. Measure that plate to compare with the original magenta, and use the new plate instead of the old one.
best, gordo
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