More Ryobi 3302 feed issues.

[lantz_xvx]

First off, I want to thank everyone for their patience and input regarding the questions I ask here. I'm new to the Ryobi and while I think I've printed some good stuff in the past couple of years, I still have a lot to learn.

I'm feeding 80# cardstock again, 11.5 x 17.5, this time on a different job. I ran 300+ sheets just fine, they were looking beautiful, when all of a sudden I started getting jam-ups. After blowing through tons of makeready and literally several hours, I can't get it to feed properly anymore.

It's picking up doubles, triples, and even quadruples. If I lower the table or the vacuum, it won't pick up at all. When it pulls a sheet, assuming it only pulls one sheet and that sheet actually makes it through the press, the next sheet is over one or more of the sheet separators. I've set the air the way the manual suggests, as well as the vacuum, I've checked all the blowers, made adjustments where necessary. I've had the table low and high, but this sucker will not feed.

Almost forgot to mention, if it manages to pull 3 or more sheets, they feed even with the double detector being set the way the manual suggests. I test it on crawl speed with a folded piece of the paper I'm running: a single sheet does not trip the eject tray, but the folded sheet does. Okay, great...right? No, the sheets are being forced through anyway.

What's going on? It was working just fine, and this is completely out of nowhere.

I'm on the first of three passes, and that's just the cover. There are six more double sided text weight pages. All things smooth, I would have been done by this time tomorrow but as it is, I'm stuck in hell with a deadline in three days. Any ideas?

Thanks,
- Lantz

 

[cmac617]

Q: grain direction on sheet??
static elim. working?
speed?

 

[cmac617]

add to that the buckle control...

 

[lantz_xvx]

Hey cmac,

The sheets are grain long. I'm not sure about the static elimination - how do I check that? All my sheets are thoroughly fanned and were working 100% fine for 300 sheets today, plus another 800 yesterday (same cover stock, different job). I've had to run at 4,000/hour to keep the cover stock feeding smoothly, but this thing I'm working on is only 500 copies so not really a big deal. The buckle seems fine; once a sheet is on the board, it's good. The pickup is what's plaguing me right now. And I can't understand why it would be feeding so many sheets at once when the double detector seems to work when I test it.

 

[RGPW17100]

I fought static all day today on the first pass. This time of year is brutal with no humidity. When you say cover is it gloss or uncoated. Curl up the problem? Try taking a couple of suckers feet off. Just use sucker feet on the outsides and one in the middle and see if that helps. When you run the text you should run it with no sucker feet. Just run vacuum at max. when you set the double sheet you should not do it on the fold. Two strips of paper is best. If you do it on the fold the thickness is closer to three sheets of paper

 

[lantz_xvx]

Hey RGPW17100,

Thanks for the tips. The paper is uncoated. I actually never take the sucker feet off and have had no problem feeding text or cover. Now that I've had some time away from it, I think that some of the paper must have been slightly bowed. I did notice a slight bow when I was jogging the sheets for the feeder, but it didn't seem like a huge problem since I had a consistent feed of around 300 sheets prior to the problems. But that paper may have been less bowed or not bowed at all. So I'm going to try to get it going today and hope for the best. Assuming I can get this cover printed, the text sheets should be easy. Should. Of course, the things that seem easy never are.

I'll keep that in mind for the double detector and will reset it today using two sheets of paper.

- Lantz

 

[lantz_xvx]

Alright, I'm at it again. I set the double detector using two sheets of paper. There's definitely not enough clearance for more than one sheet, and it did deflect some doubles already. But I'm having the same problem: the feet aren't picking up, even with vacuum and air at max. If I raise the table, even the tiniest bit, it might feed a few sheets consistently but right now I just fed 4 sheets. The paper seemed to "jump" over the double deflector somehow, because as I said, there's no clearance for two sheets, much less four sheets.

I was at a point where I was feeding makeready pretty consistently, let that run all the way through, then started feeding the clean sheets and the problems started again. This really does lead me to believe it's the paper. I re-jogged all of it and even tried to bend back some of the sheets that seemed bowed. I'm running out of ideas - and time...

 

[jimas67]

Try adjusting the pile height bar moving it forward a little. Adjust your
Back paper stop a little tighter, or mabey try making the bend in your sheet seperators a little longer

 

[western411]

Try This

Try This

You may have advanced your sucker pickup when it jammed or may have moved the position of the double sheet detector itself. There are cams on the non op side that control when the suckers pick up. Unless you know what you are doing call for service. You can check the sucker pickup point by using your manual feed handle in the front slot and turn the press until it picks up ( sucker trips ) a sheet. I turn off all but one of the sucker to find exact point of pick up. If the timing is out of wack it might explain the doubles and feeding issues. We also use shims to tilt our feed table up at the tail and then run a lower front pickup to allow more blower to vent the sheet. The tilt reduces the drag as the sheet is pulled into the press and cuts down on it pulling another sheet up with it. Your may have to move your bar back or we have also held it off the stack with rubber bands. Think of it as blowing into a v shape rather than a flat stack. Also reach under the press to the air manifold and be sure the lines and manifold are tight and in place.

 

[budgetms]

Does the press have a back blower for the paper? I'm not familiar with your press, but what you're going through brings back vivid memories of very similar problems I used to have. One thing I used to do on an old AB Dick was rig up my own blower for the back of the paper pile (the first time I actually used a hair drier duct-taped to a hand truck.) Sounds Mickey Mouse, but this really did get me through a couple of jobs like yours.

 

[acacia print]

Try adjusting the pile height bar moving it forward a little. Adjust your
Back paper stop a little tighter, or mabey try making the bend in your sheet seperators a little longer

I agree, Ryobis can be tricky little presses. If this was happening to me I would suspect that there is an uneven pile that then alows the stock to wiggle around and jump over the fingers. Often there is one finger that snaps off giving similar results. The best solution I ahve found is to get a Heidelberg. They have spung sheet guides that compensate for some uneven stock and a better control on the angle of their suction heads.... but that wont fix your problems right now....

 

[Leedsprinter]

Hi. Hope I'm not speaking out of turn as I've never run a Ryobi. I assume it doesn't have a stream feeder as I normally use. Is this any help? Feeding writing grade paper on Ryobi 3302 - Color Printing Forum

We've all been at our wits end with feeding at some time, so wishing you all the best of luck from a fellow printer the other side of the pond.

 

[Gatch]

Some great suggestions mentioned above! If after attempting those you are still having difficulty, I have one more. A drastic fix that worked when I was having problems feeding railroad board once. I had to insert makeready sheets between the good stock. I used a slightly thinner stock. It is time consuming but it did work for that job. Try it between 10-20 sheets to see if that works. I feel your pain!

 

[acacia print]

Gatch might have something there. Not a long term solution but it might work. Esp if your Ryobi has "auto" impression. Auto impression simply means that the machine is so lite that they let the whole units weight fall onto the blanket to try and get some semblance of a true "Impression"...

 

[F.I.ImGoingFishing]

Some stocks are just hard to feed,

Try smaller lifts such as 250 sheets per pile. Sometimes the weight of just 1 more ream will smash the air that fanning introduced. If this helps then adding more air from the back and or sides will allow you to increase your lifts.

Places a slightly dampened cotton pad on your back stop this helps allow for irregularities in stock length and helps reduce static for second pass

Check Sheet separators, they come in different lengths and stiffness. A good set allows you to install without having to reform on installation, OEMs are expensive but many aftermarket are to suitable to a verity of stocks. This is the most common issue that I have seen when someone is new to both the industry and the equipment. In an effort to save a couple of bucks on expendable parts we pay more than double in time and effort. Kind of like buying inexpensive rollers and not replacing them till they give you a problem.

 

[Printdog]

Check your air filters on your pump non-op side below feed table. If you run spray powder they get clogged. If they are clean check hoses off or cracks in them.

Good Luck

 

[acacia print]

Print Dog has a good Point... I had forgotten about that..

 

[speedracer]

I hate to ask, but did you check the hoses. We replaced both vac and blower hoses they were cracked and losing both air and vacuum. Also check that the blow down at the delivery is turned down this is also true at the feed end where you have the blower tubes at the back of the sheet on both sides. The last thing to do is check to see if the filters are clean sometimes they get clogged especially if you do a lot of 2 sided work and have offset powder the vacuum picks it up and will decrease the amount of vacuum.

 

[imapressman2]

Try to change height of a front & side blower nozzles, so they separate only 4-6 sheets, make sheet separators extend deeper in or out, and play with bar that touches the paper back and forth (forgot proper part name) this has to do with a table raising speed. Hope it helps...

 

[Denart]

you might find this a help

you might find this a help

All good suggestions above. One thing I find indespensable this time of year when humidity is low, is a can of "static free". The stuff you spray on a clingy garment. I can't say this will cure your problem. But it has been a help for me on occasion with feeding problems. Spray the edge of the pile lightly, not heavy enough to wet the stock. I also spray the feeder board itself. Winter time, low humidity changes everything it seems. I keep a can handy in the pressroom as well as the bindry.