Xerox DC7002 Color Issues

[LodAssoc]

We installed a DC7002 in early November 2009. We got it as an upgrade from the DC5000 that we ran for 2 years. The 5000 by the way was a fantastic machine, until about 2MM, then we had some issues with it, but overall...wonderful. We just needed something a little faster with a cheaper click charge, and were able to get a great deal on the 7002. (now i know why...)

Anyway, what I'm interested in knowing is if anybody else is having the same issues that I am:

1.) After about 5K the machine started to be extremely inconsistent with color. For example, I run real 4.25"x6" estate postcards everyday, and they are variably addressed and I run them 8-up on a 12.5"x19", 100# Cover (270gsm) Silk Coated sheet. Auto-Duplexed using a custom paper profile, set up by the Xerox color specialist when the machin was installed (we had some issues with this feature early on). On average a postcard run is 100-200 postcards, that comes out to 13-26 press sheets. After running the cards, I cut them, naturally. After cutting, I keep them in the same order that they were run. So in a pile I have a card from sheet 1, and then a card from the same position from sheet 2, and so on, through all the press sheets. Upon fanning them so that I see about an 1/8 inch of each card there is clearly a color shift from sheet to sheet. The first card might be blue, then the second purple, and the third red, and then back to blue and it continues in threes like that.

2.) I also have severe banding issues.

3.) As well as inboard/outboard variation.

I have had the color specialist and multiple technicians out to look at the problems, and then sit on there phones dumbfounded.

I might also add that they replaced the IOT of the machine on Feb. 19. The new one is what I am running currently, and it has all three issues...worse. Between the 2 machines I printed about 70K clicks and no 2 consecutive sheets have had the same color after about 5K.

And guess what they're doing next week? Replacing it again! Yipee!!! another brand new P.O.S. This one had better work. We are apparently getting this one directly off the assembly line, and it should have nothing but the test prints run on it. We'll see what happens, this is there last chance.

My question to everybody is: Who is having these same issues with a DC7002/8002. I understand that many of the '02 owners are having issue, who is having mine?

Sidebar: who knows how many owners I need to get together for a class-action? I have lost multiple clients, big clients at that, and thousands of dollars, not to mention potential income...

 

[KCJared]

Major issues with 7002 here. Send me a PM.

 

[Milo Wilson]

I work on the 7000 and I'm curious to see a sample of what is going on as far as the quality on your 7002.
If you could post some samples, I would like to see how they look.

 

[ShortRunMagazines]

How is the second replacement unit working?

 

[LodAssoc]

7002 Color issues update...

7002 Color issues update...

I haven't gotten a chance to get on here lately, so I apologize for not getting back to you guys.

Milo: I will post some sample soon. Probably in a day or two...

silurians: I use a custom profile already. It doesn't effect the banding, just lays toner on better. Also, putting less up on a sheet makes no difference. I have tried all these things.

I have a color specialist in here 2 weeks ago running samples to send to field engineering in Rochester. When he was here he ran Xerox paper. Interestingly, the xerox paper defenitly looked better. However, the issue was still evident. In running these sheets we found that we have a continuous pattern. It seems as though the banding is actually the main issue.

I have a file that is gray. It is about a 40% screen of a 4 color gray. The peice is 4x4 and I run them 12 up on a 12.5"x19" sheet. So basically the entire sheet is gray. When we print 1 sheet, we can see the banding pattern. The first section has a magenta tone to it, then the next section will be pretty close to the correct color, and then the next section will have a cyan tone to it, and then it repeats. It takes about 3 sheets for the pattern to start over, which is why i have a different color every three sheets. We figured this out b/c we pulled every thress sheets out of the tray, figuring that if it was the paper, the pattern would change....it didn't, so it's a machine issue. We did the software thing on the rip as well.

So the samples were sent to Rochester. I got word last week that they want to replace the Black developer housing, and that they are pretty sure it will fix the problem. I really don't know how they came to this conclusion, but they are e the experts, right? Interestingly, we spoke with the head of service in out region, and she told us that this is not going to fix our issue. I assume they need to come in a do somehting, that way they can say they tried.

So, in other words, my machine doesn't work. And it hasn't been written off as installed by service yet, so I am unable to order toner, or other supplies of parts. I'm sitting here with my last black cartridge in the machine, and hoping I don;t get a black heavy job, b/c i'm screwed if I do. I'm really fed up with Xerox.

We are going to start shopping around and building a lawsuit. We have lost clients, and money. Every minute i'm down, I'm losing money. It has to come to a head at some point. Anybody have the same issues as me, and would like to do something about it? Also is there a lawyer out there that would be interested in having a chat?

 

[Milo Wilson]

Sounds like an issue with the black drum. The drums on the 700 and 242 family are VERY light sensitive. I have had the same issue by accidently not getting a drum covered properly and it ruined the drum. I had to replace the drum because it was left exposed for more than 2 minutes.

 

[LodAssoc]

All drums have been replaced...

 

[Krista]

We had some issues with our 6060's that could not be traced anywhere, tech's stumped - Rochester stumped.. ended up being the floor cleaner we were using.
Crazy as it sounds - they tested the air, asked us to try changing the cleaner, troubles went away.
It was a very unique situation, although a few specialist have had air problems before, it's an unlikely answer, but figure I'd put it out there.

 

[LodAssoc]

The machine is sitting on carpet, so it only gets vacuumed, no cleaner...

 

[Milo Wilson]

Maybe a laser or halftone board issue.

 

[LodAssoc]

That is a good thought. I think they tried that when my 5000 was on it's last leg. I'll mention that to the service guys when they get here. They're on there way with a black developer housing...

I'm not holding out much hope. Thanks for the good thoughts...

 

[LodAssoc]

7002 update:

7002 update:

Well, the thechnician was in heryesterday to replace the black developer housing. He also changed out the black drum module. Can anybody guess what happpened?.....NOTHING. I have absolutely no change. I am even running on Xerox paper, just to show them that i'm following all the rules. Now they're coming back in this moring. It's going to be a technician, the color specialit, and possibly (hopefully) an engineer. Cross your fingers...

 

[Craig]

Any news... I hope for you they come up with a solution. I know exactly what your going through!

 

[LodAssoc]

Update

Update

As i said before the replaced black parts made no difference (I didn't think they would. I had 3 people out here yesterday. The C & M drums were replaced. Something about cleaner brushes rubbing them too hard, or not hard enough.

Now they are bringing out the Color Specialist, The Regional Service Manager, and a National Engineer to look over the machine. They will be coming Wed/Thur next week. Apparently there are some new improved drum modules that they want to try. They are reportedly still in their infancy a.k.a - experimantal phase. I'm not quite sure how I feel about experimantal parts...

I'll update Thurs. or Fri.

 

[Craig]

If they are the same as mine Part #13R00651, they have been on my shelf for a few weeks. There is a known issue with the drum modules. The brushes end up screwing up the drums, my tek will not replace just the drums, they ALWAYS replace the drum module and usually the whole set at the same time.

 

[LodAssoc]

Update

Update

The color specialist and a tech were in yesterday to install the "new and improved" drum modules. They replaced all 4 and also replaced the circuit boards for the 4 drums. I haven't had a chance to test it out yet. But, I'll update again when I do.

I have 2 national engineers and the color specialist coming today. Can't wait for that.

B.T.W. Craig: the new drum they brought is Part #13R00651...

 

[lensam69]

How did it go?
I've been following your story as the shop I work with is on the verge of buying a 7002.
I looks like barring image quality the Canon 7000VP Might be a better choice, based on reliability.

 

[LodAssoc]

Update 4/12

Update 4/12

OK, well it's been a little while since I posted an update, as I have been very busy running jobs on the magical machine that still doesn't work quite right...

Anyway, here's what's been going on:

on 4/1 I had my color specialist, 2 national engineers, and a paper chemist (or whatever he called himself) here to run tests. They were here for about 6 hours. They began by running all kinds of test sheets. They then proceeded to tear the entire machine apart. They were looking at all kinds of metal parts, bearing, drum shafts; writing down all kinds of numbers that are on all these parts, and looking at dates and whatnot. At one point they had the drum shafts out and were pretty sure that they were the cause of the issue. They swaped 2 of them and put the rest of the machine back together. Can anybody guess what changed when they ran sheets....NOTHING! They did however manage to get the prints to look a little better. The also blamed my paper for the issue, saying the humidity in the wharehouse is too high, and the humidity in the shop is to high. They also want me to ask the paper company to plastic wrap cartons before they ship them (right! what do you thik that would cost?). I would buy their paper xcuse if it didn't look exactly the same on Xerox, ream wrapped paper. Anyhow, they took there 300 samples and went back to Rochester...giving me no definitive answers.

So, long story short, it was still not right.

Last Friday, the color specialist called and said he was coming in to replace the Cyan and Magenta developer housings, which have already been replaced. They did the service, and I have ran some stuff since then, but it is still not right.

And now, we have yet another stop service on us. This is gettinh ridiculous!!! All our bills are payed, and they are howling about bills we got last week. The machine still does not work, the billing is all messed up, we are not getting sufficient service, etc. We've had about enough. Pretty soon Xerox will find there wonderful 7002 in the damn parking lot...

 

[Milo Wilson]

Ask your technician if he has done an NVM initialization on your machine. Sounds like software corruption . I have had a few 6060s and 8000s come back to life after doing a full NVM init.. They will have to do some re-adjustments afterwards but it may help.
There is also a setup on the lasers to compensate for image variations just like you are describing. If you ever want to give me a call my number is 714-292-6912

 

[Craig]

LodAssoc,
This may be an absolute stupid question, but.... is the machine level and installed on a solid floor (concrete)?

I really hope for your sake they move fast to get this resolved, it sound's much like what we went threw with Canon a few years ago, so I do feel your pain and frustration!!