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problems with getting mettalic inks to clean up faster

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  • problems with getting mettalic inks to clean up faster

    I am using prisco 3451u fountain solution 3oz. to a gallon and alkaless 3000 2oz. to a gallon. When I run metallic inks they take a long time to clean up on the plate when I first start up. I dont have a problem with process inks or pms inks, just metallic. Any suggestions on what I can try? I am running a mitsubishi 6-40.

  • #2
    Re: problems with getting mettalic inks to clean up faster

    Hi,

    Have you split the link between the ink and the dampening?

    Paul

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    • #3
      running to much ink with matallic will cause this. try starting out lower next time. it also seems that you are running to much sub. 1 oz to the gallon is enough.
      i also run a mitz 640 and use the same sub and fountain soup
      18oz of 3451 per 5 gallons
      5 0z 3000 per 5 gallons

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      • #4
        That's a pretty common problem, but some metallic inks run better than others. You might want to try a different brand just for a test if possible.

        They'll also do what you described if they are old. This happens a lot since most of us don't run metallics too often they tend to sit on the shelf for much longer than any of our other inks. If they're older than a year....you might want to throw them out.

        I'd also like to suggest that you try Prico's 2451 +2g. It's a 1 step that our shop replaced the 3451 with. I doubt it will help with your problem with the metallic inks, but I wanted to mention it.

        Good Luck,
        Dave

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        • #5
          We add a little Gloss varnish to metallics, it will help with transfer.

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          • #6
            Prisco also makes a product called fountain and plate cleanes. Purple stuff that uou put in the tank. Helped us a lot

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            • #7
              Try using status I density with polarized filters if you have the instrumentation. They give you a more accurate density reading and you could control your ink film a bit better. Density flats out with status T density and you don't know if you are putting too much or not enough ink.

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              • #8
                metallics are a barstard to clean off everything at end of run too, seem to take forever to come out but fortunately they dont contaminate badly... glad we rarely run them..
                Just get on with it. Its as simple as that.

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                • #9
                  Deintegrate your water rollers from the ink train! And start with thinner ink film!
                  are you running the metalic down 1st or last? Are you over printing the metalic?

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                  • #10
                    Try upping your pre-dampening, should clean it up faster.

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                    • #11
                      If I start having trouble with mettalics, the 1st thing I do is reset the mettering roller just til the water goes away. I always run mettalics in AD mode at a higher flood rev. My press allows me to have diff. flood revs. for each unit, but I know that alot of other Mitsu's don't, so you need to be careful if yours doesn't. In a sense it's not a bad thing to start off all dryed-up, atleast you won't be emusifying later on cause you know your at a good balance when you clean-up.

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                      • #12
                        The adding of gloss varnish is the most reliable way to get misbehaving inks to settle down.
                        Daniel T Roll
                        904-305-2517

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                        • #13
                          Metallics can be difficult regardless of the ink manufacturer. Adding "Water Resistant Compound" is a raw materiel that your ink supplier should be able to furnish you. This ingredient helps in both bodying up the ink and fighting off over emulsification for occuring. Remember, metallics have very little vehicle but a good slug of colorant.

                          Running your Mitsubish, you can always kick up the Delta - predamp speeds, kick up the fount and reduce the sub, and if in a real pinch - get some of the "Magic Purple Juice" that all of the manufacturers have that is to be added to the mixed fountain solution. Ours is Called "Fount Additive" and is loaded with desensitizers that aid in keeping fine screens or reverses open when running metallics. It forces the non-image area to become water receptive.

                          If you're desperate, remove the ink from the plate surface using your wash. Then clean the image area using Coca Cola ( Not Diet =) ). The acids in the soda will work as a fantastic desensitizer.

                          Good luck.

                          Best Regards,

                          Aaron Sures
                          Gracol 7 Expert
                          Aaron Sures - Pressroom Technical Specialist
                          Gans Ink & Supply Company

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                          • #14
                            ive found that its very difficult to run mettalic inks up to the full strenghth of the pms book with just a single hit. Youve got to remember that when they print these pms books they are doing it without water. What i like to do when running say a metallic gold is to go up 1 number in the pms book. For example... if the job calls for PMS 872 gold i use the stronger 873 gold then i can run it at a thinner ink film and avoid alot of problems to include the plate not cleaning up well on startup. at times ill also add a healthy sized dollup of water repellant varnish to metallic inks to increase both the tack a bit and help to stabilize the emulsion. Also someone mentioned seperating the water system from the inker. This helps too when running mettalic inks as well as very light coverage forms.
                            Last edited by turbotom1052; 08-20-2010, 05:59 AM. Reason: typo

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