Anyone know if this is inkjet?

printing4me

Member
This question is more for fun than anything. I got the Amazon catalog this morning and the dot pattern caught my eye. It is a very fine stochastic screen and I started wondering if it could be printed with inkjet. If it is inkjet it is the finest inkjet work I have seen. Does anyone know what kind of press they run this on? I feel like I can see some sweep lines but can't be sure.
 

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Alois Senefelder

Well-known member
Hello printing4me,

I very much doubt it was printed by Inkjet - reason Long Print Run!
Questions: 1) how many pages? 2) Same paper or different cover paper?

Regards, Alois
 

gordo

Well-known member
Look at the text under high magnification.

This is Inkjet:
Inkjet E.jpg


This is offset:
offset e.jpg


Stochastic screening is very common in publications and catalog work so I wouldn't be surprised if it is indeed stochastic offset.
 

printing4me

Member
@Alois Senefelder, that is one of the reasons I'd be so surprised, one the quality that looks offset and two for it to be affordable. About 94 pages cover is slightly heavier than the guts but it's probably lighter than 65lb. cover. Distibution is probably every Amazon Prime member in the U.S. @gordo here is a shot from my dad's old 30x Panasonic scope. It is not looking very offset to me :)
 

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printing4me

Member
@Magnus59 That's a new one for me :) I had to look it up. Looks possible. I am going to refer to it as "roto" to sound like I know something next time it comes up ;-)
 

gordo

Well-known member
Unlikely (though possible) to be gravure.
With gravure everything is halftone screened - including 100% K type. It looks like this:
Gravure e.jpg


The images might look a bit like stochastic screening which was mentioned.
printing4me could you post a microscope shot of a halftone screened area so that we can see the dots?
 

printing4me

Member
@gordo I'll have to do that tomorrow but it is certainly stochastic and not a normal line screen, that's what caught my eye to start. I'm 37, I can still see it without a loop ;-)
 

gordo

Well-known member
@gordo I'll have to do that tomorrow but it is certainly stochastic and not a normal line screen, that's what caught my eye to start. I'm 37, I can still see it without a loop ;-)

Gravure can look a bit like stochastic. Also it is possible that the cover was printed using a different method than the guts of the piece.
 

Magnus59

Well-known member
@Magnus59 That's a new one for me :) I had to look it up. Looks possible. I am going to refer to it as "roto" to sound like I know something next time it comes up ;-)
Don't call it "Roto", just call it Gravure, or if you really want to impress someone with your printing knowledge, call it Intaglio ;)
Many long run magazines used to be printed gravure, I'm not sure which ones in the USA, but publications like Women's Weekly which had huge circulations in their heyday were printed that way. I would expect Time Magazine and similar would be candidates for gravure over there.
 

Repro_Pro

Well-known member
In the past (end of the 20th century) the National Geographic magazine was printed Gravure in the US.
Several European editions were printed Web Offset in Spain.
 

Stickman42

Well-known member
The random dots in Gordo's inkjet "e" picture could very well be what's known as "refresh points". We have control over their frequency of appearing on the output of our Canon ColorStream inkjet printer. Their intent is to randomly fire head nozzles to keep the ink from drying and clogging in the nozzles. They serve a purpose, but are meant to be unnoticeable to the average reader. What is seen in @printing4me's zoomed in pic could be the same at a much higher firing rate, or it could be a very light tint pattern.
 
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printing4me

Member
Here are some new images I took. I am voting for some kind of high volume roll to roll inkjet. I'd imagine such a machine would have stationary heads but some of the lines I am seeing that look like sweep lines are things that I have only seen in inkjet. Something like a memjet type of technology. @Alois Senefelder @Magnus59 @gordo @Repro_Pro @Stickman42 We need an insider at Amazon to answer this :)
 

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gordo

Well-known member
Here are some new images I took. I am voting for some kind of high volume roll to roll inkjet. I'd imagine such a machine would have stationary heads but some of the lines I am seeing that look like sweep lines are things that I have only seen in inkjet. Something like a memjet type of technology. @Alois Senefelder @Magnus59 @gordo @Repro_Pro @Stickman42 We need an insider at Amazon to answer this :)
You might be right. The last image - black screened area? - suggests FM not inkjet.
What is needed is a proper microscope (about 20x-200x). One like this:

Optex.jpg

Very, very cheap on eBay (search for USB microscope). Every print shop should have one.
 

Alois Senefelder

Well-known member
Hello printing4me,


Even if it was "Inkjet" - unlikely! and it wouldn't be printed Roll to Roll, why would you print it this way?

when you need sheeted paper for the folding - Signatures.

WE need to see pics of H/tones with Black Text alongside for comparison - some at 10x, 20x and 50x

The examples you submited look like Collotype from the 19th century !

Regards, Alois
 
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printing4me

Member
@Alois Senefelder I haven't seen or heard of such a setup but I would be thinking the finishing would all be inline and straight to palletizing like a big web press. Maybe that doesn't exist but that was my thought.
 

Stickman42

Well-known member
Even if it was "Inkjet" - unlikely! and it wouldn't be printed Roll to Roll, why would you print it this way?

when you need sheeted paper for the folding - Signatures.
I've got roll fed inkjet equipment. The majority of our work is short run perfect bound books. Our setup is such that the system produces cut stacks ready to be hand fed to our perfect binders. You can configure a print system to finish the paper in a variety of ways, such as rewound (roll to roll, for offline finishing), saddlestitch, etc... Check here for examples.
 

kinni88

Active member
@Alois Senefelder, that is one of the reasons I'd be so surprised, one the quality that looks offset and two for it to be affordable. About 94 pages cover is slightly heavier than the guts but it's probably lighter than 65lb. cover. Distibution is probably every Amazon Prime member in the U.S. @gordo here is a shot from my dad's old 30x Panasonic scope. It is not looking very offset to me :)
The dots are outside the character are inkjet satellites from spray. It may be a high resolution head with very small drops, but the satellites are disappointing.
 

Alois Senefelder

Well-known member
Hello kinni88

Inkjet Printing is not my area of expertise - BUT you need to explain " Inkjet Satellite Drops" to the contributors of this post.


Regards, Alois
 

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