Choice between Thermal & Violet Laser CTP's

[mac310]

Thanks for the advise. I do feel more inclined to the Violet laser and presently looking at a 30mW.

I don't know if you want to buy anything but think about at least 60 mW to be able to use chem-free plates also. For silver plates 5 mW will be enough but you can't use any other plates. 30 mW is a border line allow to try polymer but it can be not safe. 60 mW is safe for all violet plates.

 

[karish552]

I don't know if you want to buy anything but think about at least 60 mW to be able to use chem-free plates also. For silver plates 5 mW will be enough but you can't use any other plates. 30 mW is a border line allow to try polymer but it can be not safe. 60 mW is safe for all violet plates.

Ok, will keep my eye out for atleast 60mW...in your opinion do you reckon that the quality of the polymer plates are good or the processless is better? We were advised to go with Heidelberg prosetter since we have no local support and we need a very reliable unit. In the event of down time we would have to resort to the old-fashioned way of colour separations!

 

[mac310]

After some filed tests I can see that chem-free polymer plates like Agfa Azura V is much stable than any conventional polymer plates. Because of eliminating of chemical fluctuation and base of physical cleanout that plates gives more stability, no water in process and less maintenance time for cleanout unit. When you select conventional polymer processor then you can use conventional and chem-free plates without any special problem. For Agfa and G&J processors there are special not expensive mod-kits allow eliminating water usage after changing from conventional to Azura V plates. Even if you take Heidelberg platesetter think about Agfa or G&J equivalent processor and Azura V plates (for conventional inks and run lengh about 100 000 impressions) for worse printing conditions you can use conventional N91v plates.

 

[ajr]

Have you looked at Fujis PRO V. Still has a washout solution but a very good plate.

A

 

[orsons]

What have you bought finally? Or looking till date? I am an user of Thermal CTP and I want to go for a new one. Give your feed back about the machine you had bought or feel about the machine to buy

 

[Hessel]

I suppose that someone is affraid that silver plates are only provided by Agfa. It's true, but the quality is excellent. Very high resolution (which is standard for silver halide technology), higher than any other digital plates. Run length is also high, up to 350.000 impressions. Canceling of production for violet plates are not foreseen in near future. Agfa produce so many sq. meters that this is not their intention to stop that business quicly.
Anyway, today violet engines should be equipped with high power diode (60 or 120 mW), enough to work with polymer or chem-free plates also.
It is no problem to switch from one plate to another, which is not common for Kodak platesetters.
Keep in mind that Kodak engines are "closed" and service intervention will be required if you decide to use different kind of plates in that system. AFAIK it cost a lot of money and nerves to force Kodak to allow use of "non-kodak" plates on their system.

On Kodak Thermal news Gold i can use the same resolution as i do now.
We produce 350.000 plates a year and i haven't had one plate that reached 100.000 copies.
In europe a lot of companies switch to Polymer plates. The amount of sq meters is decreasing quickly.
We are talking to Kodak at this moment and i will praise the day we singn the Kodak contract. In my opinion Agfa is a arrogant company , as long as things are ok you are their friend but when you have problems they say your company is the only company with problems. Make 5 phonecalls and you will find 4 companies with the same problems.

So my advice, whatever laser you choose don't put Agfa plates in them.....

 

[has-been]

Karish

The Kodak response appears to be a sole sales pitch. Not customer advice.

Actually, from you decription of prining needs violet plates would work very well.
Processless plates would also work - but - some limitations.
Both FUJI and AGFA have good products for violet & therma lasers
- Of course my natural preference would be FUJI (Sorry Steve).

One side issue - Kodak's downplaying of the importance of the visible image seem a little rediculous when you have to calibrate your plates.

Best of luck:
Has-been

 

[karish552]

What have you bought finally? Or looking till date? I am an user of Thermal CTP and I want to go for a new one. Give your feed back about the machine you had bought or feel about the machine to buy

We haven't bought anything as yet, still looking at the different options...I still feel more inclined towards Violet Laser and currently looking at a Heidelberg Prosetter

 

[karish552]

Karish

The Kodak response appears to be a sole sales pitch. Not customer advice.

Actually, from you decription of prining needs violet plates would work very well.
Processless plates would also work - but - some limitations.
Both FUJI and AGFA have good products for violet & therma lasers
- Of course my natural preference would be FUJI (Sorry Steve).

One side issue - Kodak's downplaying of the importance of the visible image seem a little rediculous when you have to calibrate your plates.

Best of luck:
Has-been

Thanks for your response.

Processless is not really a must for us, we are happy to use polymer or any other plates that would give good quality on a Violet laser...our main concern is plate preparation time, since we will be printing a newspaper that needs to be out in the early hours of the morning...and the other concern is maintenance costs in the long run and this seems to be cheaper for the Violet compared to the Thermal.

Thanks,
Karish.

 

[Mel Ellis]

Nataional Sales Manager

Nataional Sales Manager

We, Antalis are a supplier of Kodak CTP SYstems. We have supplied more than 110 thermal system to the Southern African market including the Indian Ocean islands. Thermal dominates in our market as it is a reliable, consistent imaging product and in addition there are many thermal plate suppliers as opposed to a very limited amount of suppliers for violet. As a matter of interest we do offer a violet solution using ECRM platesetters but we have found that the amount of process control necessary for violet is a negative factor. Thermal requires very little process control and once installed give us very little problems.
We do support installations in the Seychelles and we agree with Kevin that thermal is right way to go!

 

[Hessel]

Indeed Thermal is the way to go. We will make the same switch.
We will probably order 2 Generation News Systems.

 

[mac310]

... In my opinion Agfa is a arrogant company , as long as things are ok you are their friend but when you have problems they say your company is the only company with problems. Make 5 phonecalls and you will find 4 companies with the same problems.

So my advice, whatever laser you choose don't put Agfa plates in them.....

OK it is your opinion. I have similar impression about our local Kodak support. They work here like hunters and doesn't care about existing customers. Everything depends on local situation I suppose, but Agfa has big Plate System Support organisation and those people can solve problems quickly. Maybe local organisation or dealer doesn't collaborate properly with them.

 

[Hessel]

Wel the plate factory and HQ are 200km from our plant. So when we have problems people from HQ come to our plant. But they have no solution for our plate problems..... but this is a little off topic......

 

[frailer]

The thermal/violet debate sure isn't dead! Just to say here that we have been violet users, and overall very happy for about 3 years. Some things to be said.
-5 years/5,000 hours operating time warranty on the single violet laser, whichever comes first. As MarkTonk says, they're used in Blu-Ray. There's a few around = low unit cost, (comparatively). The 'expensive' part is the optics/sipnner unit that puts the single laser to work.
-be sure you understand the difference between processless, and chem-free. I'm very much looking forward to going to chem-free when he right time comes. Sure, there's a wash-out system, but to get rid of the dev stage...woo hoo! If you were to consider violet, I would really look into chem-free. Don't know what its install take-up has been, worldwide, but am about to try and find out what would be a reasonable leap-time for us.
-we are on Fuji LP-NV2. Measurable 1%~99%.

I would think your biggest issue would be your location...for service/supply. Would imagine that would be highest on your list.
Good luck. It's a vexing decision time. Been through it.