CPC 1.02 curves setting

[Mark83]

Hi guys, i have a problem with my CPC 1.02 consolle. My CPC have a modific with job card reader i removed tape reader. With prepress interface i do ppf file to set ink Keys of my vp102 heidelberg. Which is the right mode to set the printing curves? Change curves in cpc1.02? Do a new set curves in prepress interface? Set a transfert curves in prepress interface? Simeone know the right mode?
Thanks a lot

 

[aqazi81]

I don't remember there was any option of curves in CPC 1.02.

 

[Mark83]

someone tell me that in dos mode i can set the curves in cpc 1.02, but with which program? i don't know.
the only solution tha i find is to modify the transfer curve in prepressinterfare, but this solution is not very good.

 

[aqazi81]

That I believe is done in CPC 1.04. See the attached pdf.

 

[Ret Heidelberg Instructor]

Aquazi81, I believe that you are correct. Curve modification was introduced on the CPC 1.04. The CPC 1.02 was an earlier version of press software with limitations. Note to Mark 83, DOS was not a format that was used on the CPC. 1.02. It was a valid format on early DI Series of presses.

 

[Mark83]

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you say, there aren't any solution to set curves in cpc 1.02? in PPI if i do some settings to transfer curves there are some changement in ink keys cpc 1.02, but if i set the curves when i go in cpc 1.02 there aren't changement in ink keys. The only solution i find is set transfer curves (like image), it's normal that carachteristic curves not do changement in ink keys?
Someone give any idea!
Please

 

[Ret Heidelberg Instructor]

Mark, Pre Press interface would send basic data of ink key calculations to the press. I do not believe that you are able to modify those calculations and then send them to the press with CPC 1.02. On CPC 1.04 basic ink calculations were sent to the press via PPI. The curve adjustments would have to be created on the CPC 1.04 console and then applied when the data was transferred. Think of it like this. In CPC 1.04 the operator could create, and modify curves and store them in the CPC memory. When the basic data was sent to the press from PPI, the data would be altered by the curve that the operator created for each color. The amount of Fountain Roller percentage would not change. I will try to give you a basic example.

PPI Data for yellow on a Print Job Fountain Roller Percentage 35% Ink Zone Values for all 32 ink zone keys:

25 25 28 28 35 35 35 35 35 47 47 47 40 40 40 35 35 35 30 30 30 30 35 35 35 20 20 20 15 15 15 15

Curve adjustment created in CPC 1.04 by press operator. Operator wants a 20% increase because he finds that the basic data from PPI gives not enough ink.

Now the the PPI basic yellow value is sent to the press. Now the curve will be applied to increase the ink keys by 20%.

Fountain Roller Percentage 35% Ink Zone values with 20% adjustment up now look like this:

30 30 32 32 42 42 42 42 42 56 56 56 48 48 48 42 42 42 36 36 36 36 42 42 42 24 24 24 18 18 18 18

I might not be correct on my calculations but I was never good in mathematics.

I hope this explains it a little bit more clearly.

 

[Mark83]

Yes all you said is true, infact with my SM52 with cpc 1.04 i do in this mode i change the setting curves in my consolle.
The problem is with my SM102 with cpc 1.02 with job card. how i do to set curves? the only mode i found is to set transfer curves in PPI, but the problem is that the aperture of yellow is not the same of black, cyan or magenta, if you see the image that i post the transfer curves are very very changed. The consolle was inizialized when it's maked, but this setting isn't good for me, there is some mode to set new curves in my consolle?

 

[Ret Heidelberg Instructor]

Sorry Mark, I do not think that it is possible to modify a curve in the CPC 1.02 because the technology is not there. You have to take the basic data that the PPI sends to the flash card and make adjustments manually on the press. Could you please send a photo of the CPC console that you have on your current press? I am need to see something that might help assist you

 

[Mark83]

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in photo there is my consolle

 

[Ret Heidelberg Instructor]

Mark, I don't know if you have the right software in your CP TRonic (the Console attached to your CPC 1.02). I may be wrong but if you want to try something it might work. Select the Service Button (Wrench) on the CP tronic and see if there are sub menus for service. You might see a menu for Curves that will look the same as you have on your SM52 with CPC 1.04. If the menu is there then I think that you might be able to create curves. When you create the curves that you want then you should be able to apply them to the data from the PPI.

The CPC 1.04 console was a more simple way to connect the CPC 1.02 and the CP Tronic into one unit.

 

[Mark83]

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the photo attached is menu service i can see!
here are many menu activable with some tecnic?
Thanks a lot for your professionality

 

[aqazi81]

Your press does not have the option to create characteristic curves from CP Tronics, otherwise you see a curves Icon just below the lubrication icon. See the attached file.

 

[Mark83]

ok ! thanks a lot for your interesting! i know there aren't any solutions to set carachteristic curves! only solution is to buy a INK ZONE product or other similar system controll ink , image controll, or other solution more expansive to buy for this machine. Before to connect some system controll ink keys i must install board BEK.
Thanks a lot, if you have some other last idea please contact me beaucouse i don't want to buy system more expansive..

 

[aqazi81]

Invest in a good pressman who knows how to adjust the ink keys. Too many button pushers out there.

 

[Mark83]

i have a good pressman, but the time to set a perfect print is too much always. in my SM52 with cp 1.04 and a perfect caractheristic curves setting my other pressman don't touch never button, he swicth on and go.
The color is always perfect. i thank you maybe must i give up to set it.

 

[Andrei83]

Hello , Support position , area coverage value 40 -70 % there isn't enough density of blue color (a little). It is necessary to add 40 Dio. I need to add equally Z1 and Z2 40 Dio ? Or for Z2 smaller value is necessary (for example 18 Dio).​

 

[Manprint]

You could change the amount of ink key read from memory console, to do that you have to press the load job button and hold the flashing ! then pick one color -eg 1 black- now you can press + or - to compensate for more or less ink feed.

Also when you put ink keys from memory to console with preset button BEFORE you press green, you can alter ink ductor sweep with minimal loss of ink keys eg when you load job ink key 5 is at 3 coarse 14 fine if you give 5% more sweep, ink key 5 will lower to 3 coarse 6 fine or the other way if you decrease sweep 5% 4 coarse 2 fine.
These numbers are not exact per se but they are an example to get the hang of it.

By the way try to fingerprint the machine and make prepress curves

 

[Mark83]

Manprint you are genial man!
Your procedure is perfectly functionant, i set for all ink type the right percentual on ink.
i use your first solution, is better than second, beaucouse the first is for all job, the second is only for the actual job.
THANKS A LOT for this problem i contacted heidelberg italia and they don't knew this procedure.
You solved me a big problem.
There are any other solution to set the key 1 with the 2 and the 3 the 4 .....the 32 for all key, so you have the same ink opening on all keys?
The way I found and unplug the encoder manually, open or close the key with a screwdriver and reassemble the encoder. Is this the only procedure or is there any software?
i

 

[Manprint]

Glad to be of assistance, as for the reset of ink keys, i think it is only mechanical procedure not software, you can read this procedure at colorprintingforum https://www.colorprintingforum.com/threads/xl-105-ink-keys.4478/#post-17327 -never done it before-.
As for Heidi Italia tell them to read the stupid manual -i did it in German with google translate lol-