Creative Cloud thoughts

[leonardr]

Once this program gets established and people get on board they will be held hostage to any price increase Adobe chooses to make. There will now be NO option other than to pay Adobe as your software will cease to exist if a company chooses to opt out of the cloud program due to price increases. And once that happens all legacy files will be trash as they probably will not work with CS6 in the future after a few upgrades.

This is a very common misunderstanding about the Creative Cloud and is simply NOT TRUE.

All subscription members will be able to access previous versions (I forget if it's one or two versions back) for archival & compatibility purposes. So, if you do choose to stop your subscription, you will have access to previous versions. And you can restart your subscription at any time - and catch right back up!

I just do not see ANY benefit for a printer. Am I missing something?

Each person, company, industry, etc. will need to determine if it is in their business interest or not. Just as you choose where to spend your money on everything else in your business - be it hardware, internet access, phone lines or beer & pretzels - whether to move to the Creative Cloud is up to you. I can only help you understand what WE see as the benefits to the wider set of our users.

If you choose not to join, it's your choice. We're sorry to see you go and wish you the best.

 

[toronar]

This is a very common misunderstanding about the Creative Cloud and is simply NOT TRUE.

All subscription members will be able to access previous versions (I forget if it's one or two versions back) for archival & compatibility purposes. So, if you do choose to stop your subscription, you will have access to previous versions. And you can restart your subscription at any time - and catch right back up!

Did I get this right?
If I subscribe to CC for e.g. 3 years and then stop my subscription, the CC programs will still work, just not the current version but older ones?

As in: InDesign CC3 is the current version, I cancel my subscription, I can still work with InDesign CC2?

 

[zoran]

Each person, company, industry, etc. will need to determine if it is in their business interest or not. Just as you choose where to spend your money on everything else in your business - be it hardware, internet access, phone lines or beer & pretzels - whether to move to the Creative Cloud is up to you. I can only help you understand what WE see as the benefits to the wider set of our users.

If you choose not to join, it's your choice. We're sorry to see you go and wish you the best.

I've seen this same response from some other Adobe evangelists and employees in this last week and I can not say I appreciate this attitude.
When your huge customer base is unhappy with move you are making and wants to be heard, you want to engage in conversation to try and repair relationship, not enrage people even more.

Fact is that we are paying more, we are getting more useless stuff (we barely even scratch capabilities of CS right now) that we don't need and all is shoved down our throats in "take it or leave it" fashion.
Not good for anyone.

On the bright side, I liked Hitler's video

 

[Fatboysmart]

That's what happens if a company basically has a monopoly position...

 

[leonardr]

If I subscribe to CC for e.g. 3 years and then stop my subscription, the CC programs will still work, just not the current version but older ones?

Sort of.

During your subscription, you will have access to the current product (of course) and an "archival copy". To start, that's the CC version and the CS6 version. At some point, we will replace CS6 with some other "stable release" that you will be able to keep around and use should you choose to stop your subscription.

 

[leonardr]

When your huge customer base is unhappy with move you are making

I think this is the crux of the matter that folks need to understand. Adobe DOES have a HUGE user base with its Creative Suite products. A VERY diverse user base. From professional printers, to hobbyist photographers, to web designers to videographers to students and LOTS of stuff in between. No matter what we do, on any given day, we will make some part of that base unhappy - it's just reality.

So the move to Creative Cloud & Subscriptions is just the latest business decision that we have made, and you folks (ie. printers) are a group that clearly doesn't see the benefit. We understand that, and we're sorry. But we are moving away from shrink wrap/perpetual licenses, and that's a decision we won't be reversing. However, if the idea of a monthly charge isn't to your liking, we have other options - whether that's for you to "pay a year in advance (and save some $$)" or even go so far as a Enterprise License (that also gets you support and other benefits).

and wants to be heard, you want to engage in conversation to try and repair relationship, not enrage people even more.

And Dov and I are here and happy to talk to you about it.

Perhaps, if you could give us some idea of what you would want from a subscription that WOULD be useful to you, we could take that back to the powers that be and see about having those things added. We certainly want folks to feel that they are getting benefit from their subscriptions.

 

[brent]

Personally, I cannot see anything being useful in a subscription for print providers. While updates are nice, the fear of not having our legacy files in a form that is editable in the future scares the crap out of me. Who knows where Adobe will be in 5-10 years. Hopefully thriving and strong, but what if Adobe gets bought out or crashes and burns? Where are we then? Will we be stuck with hundreds or thousands of files that we cannot use? Our customer's will not care that we cannot open their files…they just want their project on press with their alterations in a timely matter.

What if in the future Adobe decides to raise their price so much that the mom and pop shops can no longer afford the subscription? Times are tough in our industry. Shops are closing at a record rate.

Adobe used to be VERY printer friendly… the Partnership program was key in letting printers do business transparently across different platforms.

You say there will always be a "archival copy" of the software available…but will that open and have the ability to edit the current CC files? That functionality was never in place before…i.e. you cannot open a CS 6 file in 5.5. Are you saying we can open CC files in CS6? I doubt it. I am sure files can be save as an IDML file or something, but that will not guarantee the files will be perfect. Customers will continue to save their files as InDesign files. Do we as printers have to save every file we receive from a customer into a different file format, just in case?

I guess my biggest fear lies in the "what if?" category. If Adobe went out of business today, My files would still be intact and fully usable with my current software. Or…if times were tough, we could still get by on our current version of software, by not upgrading this time around. With a subscription, that potentially may not be the case.

You ask for ideas of what we as printers would want in a subscription base package, and I really do not have an answer for that. While having updates quickly is nice, most printers I know wait to update their software to make sure it "plays nice" with all of our toys that we have to output to.

Man I hate to sound like a negative nancy. I love Adobe's CS suite. I have been using your software since the beginning with the first version of Photoshop. I couldn't wait when Indesign arrived and finally became stable so I didn't have to use Quark anymore. It was a happy day in our shop!

 

[gordo]

@leonardr

Thanks for participating and not ignoring this conversation.

Best, gordo

 

[GLMTart]

Sort of.

During your subscription, you will have access to the current product (of course) and an "archival copy". To start, that's the CC version and the CS6 version. At some point, we will replace CS6 with some other "stable release" that you will be able to keep around and use should you choose to stop your subscription.

How long do you have subscribe to receive the upgraded release? I have CS3 at home yet and would be more than willing to subscribe for a year or even less if that gets me up to CS6+ after I stop the subscription.

 

[Hopkins Printing]

Sort of.

During your subscription, you will have access to the current product (of course) and an "archival copy". To start, that's the CC version and the CS6 version. At some point, we will replace CS6 with some other "stable release" that you will be able to keep around and use should you choose to stop your subscription.

Hi Leonard,

Just to be sure......If I buy a CC membership and need a previous version of CS (CS6 or 5.5 for example) and then choose to let my membership expire, the older CS software will continue to function while the CC software will not after the membership has expired...right?

Thanks,
hp

 

[brent]

As much as I hate to say this, it might be time to revisit Quark.

 

[zoran]

As much as I hate to say this, it might be time to revisit Quark.

I don't think Quark is solution, they could not get their stuff together for years, what makes you think they will do it now??

 

[zoran]

Sort of.

During your subscription, you will have access to the current product (of course) and an "archival copy". To start, that's the CC version and the CS6 version. At some point, we will replace CS6 with some other "stable release" that you will be able to keep around and use should you choose to stop your subscription.

This is what I have trouble understanding.
The way you are presenting is that we will have access to CC version that can edit and save files even if we stop subscription. We might not have abillity to edit newer files from that date going forward but previous files, sure. That is not how it looks like on Adobe web site.
So is this interpretation correct?

Also, I will wait until Enterprise and volume license pricing gets published, as long as we are not paying more than what we are paying now and we have this ability to access and edit files even if we kill subscription, for the most part would be ok.

There is still question of version edits, how is that going to be resolved.
We all know that with every new version with new features and fixes, something else breaks, like e.g. type engine and you get reflow.
For this particular reason we folks in Prepress are always maintaining multiple versions of CS, 3, 4, 5 and 6 to open incoming files in respective version, otherwise sometimes there are unexplainable text reflows and we end up eating the cost.

 

[leonardr]

You say there will always be a "archival copy" of the software available…but will that open and have the ability to edit the current CC files? That functionality was never in place before…i.e. you cannot open a CS 6 file in 5.5. Are you saying we can open CC files in CS6?

No. Instead, we will ensure that the current CC versions always have the ability for users to "Save to archival version" (it won't be called that, of course, but you understand what I mean).

 

[leonardr]

How long do you have subscribe to receive the upgraded release? I have CS3 at home yet and would be more than willing to subscribe for a year or even less if that gets me up to CS6+ after I stop the subscription.

Great question. I don't know for certain, so PLEASE don't quote me on this.

But I believe the answer is one year. You would need to purchase a year in advance or be a member for one year (on the monthly plan).

 

[leonardr]

If I buy a CC membership and need a previous version of CS (CS6 or 5.5 for example) and then choose to let my membership expire, the older CS software will continue to function while the CC software will not after the membership has expired...right?

Not ANY previous version - just the one single version that we currently make available as the "archival copy".

 

[brent]

Not ANY previous version - just the one single version that we currently make available as the "archival copy".

And will that version be stable when we open and edit legacy cloud files?

Oh, and Leonard...Thanks for being patient with us and answering all our questions. It is much appreciated. I have been talking to alot of guys in prepress locally here in other shops...We all have alot of concerns with this new program. It's great you are here fielding our questions and concerns. I for one will not try and shoot the messenger!

 

[MickRose]

future CC versions

future CC versions

Not ANY previous version - just the one single version that we currently make available as the "archival copy".

If I subscribe for 12 months to the CC version, what happens when a new version comes out (CC2) and I decide to cancel my subscription? Will I still be able to use CC to open and change files or will I be locked out of these files until I resubscrbe?

 

[leonardr]

And will that version be stable when we open and edit legacy cloud files?

No. Just as CS5 can't (necessarily) open CS6 files - the "archival copy" won't open the latest versions.

However, the latest versions will be able to "save to archival", if necessary.

 

[leonardr]

If I subscribe for 12 months to the CC version, what happens when a new version comes out (CC2) and I decide to cancel my subscription? Will I still be able to use CC to open and change files or will I be locked out of these files until I resubscrbe?

It's still very early and we don't really have a specific time frame/plan for when/how often we will release archival versions. Whenever we do, you can "squirrel them away" as you see fit.