Hardware configuration for CREO SPIRE

[funwork]

Hi,
We are in the process of buying a XEROX 242 printer with a CREO RIP.
While the RIP comes with the pro kit option (spectro, VDP, ...) our dealer says that we will have to provide the PC + OS (Windows XP) that will host the CREO application.
We should have the RIP comes with a box but it is an option.

- Is this something normal ? is the CREO supposed to be installed on the printer HDD and having it installed on an external box an option ?

- I understand have CREO installed on an external box a better choice and have this box equiped with a keyboard, mouse and LCP screen a recommander option.

My questions, assuming we have to buy the box, is :
- What kind of configuration would you recommand ?
- I've found the specs of the PC offered by Xerox as their option : Core Duo 2 2.4Ghz, 1Gb RAL DDR2, HD : 1x80Gb + 2x80Gb
- Regarding the HD : what combination would you recommand ? I understand from what I have read on Xerox website that I will need : 1 Hd of 80Gb for the OS, 2 80Gb HD place in RAID for the images (is it a RAID 0 or a RAID 1)

Thanks for your answers.

 

[mattbeals]

The shop that I was at it came on a Dell server as a complete package with the server, monitor, keyboard, mouse, stand, spectro etc. All we did is plug in the ethernet and power cables. The tech did everything else.

But a single quad core processor, 4GB of RAM (max for Windows XP). For the storage I'd go with SATA II drives at 7200 RPM. Either get two physical cards or one dual channel card. Of course if you can get Ultra 320 SCSI I'd go with that. Depends on the budget. RAID 1 will mirror one drive to another. RAID 0 will spread the data across N number of discs. RAID 0 is the fastest but is just as unprotected as a single drive when it comes to failure. This will RAID - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia explain the RAID levels and common uses.

 

[Amer]

RAID 0 will spread the data across N number of discs. RAID 0 is the fastest but is just as unprotected as a single drive when it comes to failure.

Actually, you are 3 times less protected - it only takes 1 drive to fail and you lose ALL your data.

 

[funwork]

Thanks for your comments.
My first question was to confirm that it wasn't unusual that the customer has to provide the PC. I thought that the hardware was part of the RIP.

Second, for the hardware configuration a few question lies unclear to me...
1-Do I need a special graphic card (I guess not)
2-What is a fusion card ? Do I need to provide one ? On the CREO specs of their machine they're talking about a fusion card.
3-For the HD, i'll take 1 for the OS and 1 or 2 in a RAID for the images.
Is a RAID 0 something that will speed up the process ?

Thanks for your feedback

 

[X33]

this is totally unusual.

are you in the US? are you buying this new from Xerox Corporation or a Xerox Agent?

 

[mattbeals]

I'd always suggest a dedicated video card. No, it's not required but it does help. Never heard of a "fusion card". If it's required then they can provide it or guidance for where to get it. You can do the three drive setup if you want, one OS/applications drive and the other two as a stripe for data only. Will RAID 0 speed it up? Yes because you spread the I/O across two discs acting as one. But if one dies, all the data is gone and you have to rebuild the volume.

 

[funwork]

Thanks again for your feedback.

X33, I am living in Guadeloupe in the Caribean (French island)
The seller is the offical Xerox agent for the region.
I find it really strange that they do not provide at least the box !
What do you think about this situation ?

For the config, if I have to set it.
I'll go with a video card + a stripped set of 2 HD.

Thanks

 

[Harrob]

Hi,

The Creo is a propriety hardware configuration. It generally consists of three hard drives, one for the actually system software including the OS and the Creo Spire application. The other two disks are the image disks which store the rastered data. The fusion board is used for page compiling such as imposition, pulling cached images for VDP, applying calibration, gradation curves, etc, and is the video card that connects the RIP to the engine.

It would seem very unusual that you would have to provide the hardware as this would be impossible to do so.

 

[funwork]

OK, thanks for all your answers.
I guess it's time for a serious conversation with our local Xerox dealer !

To put in simply, buying a CREO RIP is buying the software + the hardware (only the box)
The stand + keyboard + screen + mouse in an option, not the box !

Our dealer has included "for free" on his offer the PRO KIT option (spectro, extra things,...) For him, it is valued at 9800€ (that would be at the current rate 13000 USD)

The price offered is 43500€ for a 242 + SRA3 feeder with air pulsing + CREO RIP with the pro kit option (but without the hardware )

We have been working for years with this dealer and everything always went fine.
I just don't want to end up paying the double of the price or paying for a machine that will miss half of it's power because my dealer made a few "economy" !

Again, thanks for you precious info.
If you want to give me your feedback on the above prices, feel free to do it !

Thanks !

Frank

 

[mattbeals]

I think the cost was $21,000 for everything (a couple of years ago).

 

[funwork]

Well...
I thought a phone call would be OK but I think all of this deserve a -nice- meeting !

Anyway, thanks for the infos !

 

[mattbeals]

Yeah, for that kind of money a sitdown meeting is certainly resonable regardless of the situation.

 

[funwork]

I think so !

 

[X33]

The Creo is a propriety hardware configuration.

I second this.

I don't think you can put together a workstation that matches the actual CREO HW configuration. The CREO FUSION BOARD is very important, you can't live without it.

 

[funwork]

With all your enlightment I can tell for sure that there will be some rock'n'roll today !

Thanks a lot !

 

[javadave]

Our CX242

Our CX242

We have two Docucolor 240s, each with a Creo CX250 RIP, and a Docucolor 242 with a CX242 RIP (the newer model of the three). All three came as a bustled hardware set that hung from the back of the printer with no monitor, keyboard or mouse. We upgraded each to the Control Station kit that includes a stand, monitor, keyboard, mouse, and DVD drive. The bustled RIP was moved by the installer from the back of the printer to the back of the stand. In our case, this is definitely a proprietary piece of hardware. There is a dedicated Cat5 cable (SONET?) that connects the scanner at the top of the printer to the RIP for retrieving scans and performing calibrations. There is also a large cable that looks like SCSI that connects the printer to the RIP.

As I understand it, the Professional kit upgrade primarily allows one to print CMYK separations from the Spire RIP. Without this ~$10,000US option (a dongle containing a software patch), it is not possible to print separations on the printer. Even if you print a pre-separated file, or print seps from your sending application, the RIP will automatically recombine them into a composite image. There is no way to turn this off, and if you try to send a single plate, it will not print. The Professional option, however, is still flawed because the software still creates a CMYK composite, then reseparates it into CMYK. Any additional plates (i.e., spot colors) are not able to be printed as separations.

We are extremely happy with our printer/RIP combinations. The RIPs are very capable and very easy to use compared with a Fiery RIP. Our only complaint has been about the intentional omission of a capability which has existed in every postscript device since the laserwriter--separations.

 

[funwork]

OK.
For the box issue, I had an explanation with the people from Xerox. Seems the sales person that I first talked to wasn't really aware of everything...
All in one, the printer will come with a CREO box that may be moved to a stand with keyboard, etc and that is an option.
Thanks for all your precious feedback.

One last thing is about the professional kit.
I've understood it is a dongle that will include a spectro, a few more options (imposing options and things like that)

As our main activity is VDP, do you think this option is a must for us ? We don't really need the spectro as the machine will be serviced by Xerox techs.
All we need is to be able to print VDP at the maximum speed and with the max quality.

It appeared that removing the pro kit would help to lower the quote but I don't have any detail on this option. They will send it to me tomorrow the details but I would like to hear your comments on it first !

Again, thanks for all your sharing. I live in a really small Island in the Caribean where rhum and sun is something that we never miss...Not the same for expert advices so thank you !

 

[javadave]

Imposition/VDP

Imposition/VDP

I couldn't speak to the VDP options, though it seems like I've seen some software utilities related to that on the boxes.

As for imposition, the Spire handles that out of the box. It can even do booklets. After the Professional dongle was added to one of ours (the 242), I didn't find any new options except for the separation ability.

 

[funwork]

On the presentation sheet the speak about VDP improvement... I can't find what is IMPROVEMENT for CREO !

Anyway, thanks again

 

[JCA]

Creo SPire

Creo SPire

I work for a Xerox company and have sold many Creo Spire RIPs. All Creo Spire RIPs come from Creo with the hardware. Your distributor is trying to get more money out of you. Good luck.