iGen 150

722,000 starting price. I'm glad I don't have to fix anything that expensive I can't imagine how picky those people would be :)
 
msaeger said:
I can't imagine how picky those people would be :)
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Picky.... really! Maybe you don't understand the fact that us "picky people" actually rely on these machines to make a living for us and our employees. Maybe you don't understand that we are only asking these machines to perform like the brochures and sales monkeys lead us to believe they will. Obviously you should only be fixing "office" machines that have pleasing color. You DO NOT have the mentality to be a production service tech. and your ass would be flying out of my door if you were to make a comment like that in my shop!
 
Craig said:
Picky.... really! Maybe you don't understand the fact that us "picky people" actually rely on these machines to make a living for us and our employees. Maybe you don't understand that we are only asking these machines to perform like the brochures and sales monkeys lead us to believe they will. Obviously you should only be fixing "office" machines that have pleasing color. You DO NOT have the mentality to be a production service tech. and your ass would be flying out of my door if you were to make a comment like that in my shop!
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Spoken like a person who paid a tad too much for a machine, expecting something more from a copier. It's no surprise that when people pay for something so expensive their demeanor changes. My understanding is that digital is a supplement to offset printing, not a solution. Unless you are a Kinko's shop.

PS. Before buying something next time ask the tech guy first not the sales person.
 
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bruceprint said:
Spoken like a person who paid a tad too much for a machine, expecting something more from a copier. It's no surprise that when people pay for something so expensive their demeanor changes. My understanding is that digital is a supplement to offset printing, not a solution. Unless you are a Kinko's shop.

PS. Before buying something next time ask the tech guy first not the sales person.
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Spoken like someone who hasn't seen good digital!

Digital print might be a supplement at some shops, but I've seen plenty of printers that are not only 100% digital but damn good at it.
 
@msaeger - from our experience, we are xerox reps, service and distribution, Xerox offers better support ( technically ) than other manufacturers. But this is based on our teritory. I can understand what you say about picky customers, but from our experience, this generally happens with lower spec machines. Practical example : expecting production performance from an office machine.

At the same time, Craig is also right. Because sales people deliver the expectations, the customer developes his business plans around it. When considering the large aquisition prices, you have to understand that business owners are not very "entertained" by such comments.

For example, we try to avoid certain customers because we do not think that their equipments will deliver their expectations. We try to offer them different machines, but at the same time we try to be fair with them from the start. Also, we never take service contracts from customers that do less than 75% of the resonable volumes for their machine. These are customers that one way or the other will become frustrated with their work, and take it out on the sales and tech representatives.
 
bruceprint said:
Spoken like a person who paid a tad too much for a machine, expecting something more from a copier. It's no surprise that when people pay for something so expensive their demeanor changes. My understanding is that digital is a supplement to offset printing, not a solution. Unless you are a Kinko's shop.

PS. Before buying something next time ask the tech guy first not the sales person.
Click to expand...

On the contrary, I would bet I know more about a machine than any of the sales people before I buy it, hell half of the service techs can barely find the on/off switch. You see, my bitch is the lackadaisical tech like msaeger, who walks in and the first thing out of their mouth is "it's the paper". Or who thinks any color on a sheet is "good enough".

You see Bruceprint, I have made a rather good business from print, both offset and digital. I know that I can make more money from my market with digital than with offset, is it the end all be all? Nope, but neither is offset. My problem with a tech like mseager would be equal to that of having a Heidelberg tech saying "I can't imagine how picky those people would be" when Heidleberg launches a new press. So Bruceprint, it's the mindset of that tech. that can make or break a shop whether digital or offset. The digital techs need to hold themselves to a higher standard in a print for pay environment.
 
billyinlasvegas said:
Digital print might be a supplement at some shops, but I've seen plenty of printers that are not only 100% digital but damn good at it.
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Amen to that...we're 100% digital and wouldn't have it any other way. You better believe I'm "picky" , and I pay dearly for that privilege.
 
We are 100% digital and do around $2.5mil a year. Not a big shop but, we are not just a copy shop even though we do not own any iron.
 
We're also 100% Digital and are knocking the socks off of local offset operations. Our niche is producing high-quality variable image, variable data output that just simply can not be done in offset (like 24 to 32 page variable image 6 x 9 booklets where all the data, as well as the pictures, change from booklet-to-booklet based on over 1,500 variables in the data). And yes, due to bad experiences in service from other vendors, our color operation is 100% Xerox. No other equipment vendor can match their response and, how fast they can get a machine back up and running. Other vendors have to overnight parts, put it in the next day when the part arrives, if that doesn't solve the problem they have to order additional parts, put them in the following day, if that doesn't work........on an on. Sometimes, with the other vendors, we would have a machine down for 4 to 5 days going through this process. We've been with Xerox now for about 4 years, and, I can only recall on 1 occasion where we were down more than 4 hours. And, just in case you were wondering, NO, we were not interested in spending extreme amounts of money on their iGen product. Not sure why anyone would, although, I know some have. We're using more resonable Xerox Digital Production Presses (DC8000's & 8002's) and, in my humble opinion, the quality exceeds the iGen product.
 
Good thread

Good thread

Good thread. I myself was curious if anyone here in the states or abroad have seen and compared the igen 150 to other machines, including past igen products and production copiers like the 8000 and some competitor offerings...

I have a love/hate relationship with all things print. I'm not the biggest fan of inkjet presses but they're supposedly the cheapest to run.

I have a deep history with toner based products, mostly office production, fixing and servicing but I have a passion for offset, even though I've never serviced true presses.

I believe any of the copier companies "digital presses" are really just beefed up copier/printers...although they are more durable and yes quality can be much better depending on what you have and how you take care of it. They are made better but cost more as well.

Hands down though, I'd say none of the other options out there come close to how robust the offset press is. They seem to run decades, again if properly maintained, and the technology is the oldest going back to around 1875 I think. Of course they cost the most up front.

The toner devices are getting better at having a less glossy look from the waxy component of the toner molecules but I still like the gentleness and permanency of the offset ink. I think it's cool how I have bound books two or three times my age with the paper turning yellow and getting brittle but the offset ink is still there; just as easy to see and read as the day it was printed.

There's just something magical about offset ink on a page. With toner, it's like it's hanging on there with dear life, like it's glued on top of the paper (fused actually); but with offset ink on paper it's like the very being of those two distinct components have reformed into one; like the souls of two lovers during a moment of passion...

I really think the answer lies in making a whole new device which merges all of the technologies together so you can do cost effective short runs with variable data but have offset ink like qualities.
 
Hmm...sounds interesting.

I watched a few of the short clips on youtube. It looks promising and may be an industry changer but I'm not over anxious yet.

A lot of times these things are more hype and BS than what the pretty videos and marketing say they are...but it could be something.
 
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