konica 12000 VS Ricoh 9200

[slimbh]

Hi,

Any one has test new KONICA C12000 machine?
We are looking for changing our two Konica C1085 machine by more productive one and more reliable. We need machine that require less maintenance so less downtime.

Ricoh 9200 seem to be solid machine with about 1M copy without as to change any part.

Our konica C1085 is great machine, 8M on one and 4M for other. the only bad thing is corona and drum life are too short sonnet to change them many time and recalibrate machine so big downtime.

Also we have critical issue with fuser that broke about 300000 copy (not one time reach 1M as they say) so it cost us very expensive to prepare each time.

So with new 12000, we need to know about fuser, drum...

Thanks,

 

[azehnali]

fuser and drum life will never reach 1,000,000 impressions on any machine ever unless you do not care about quality and only run 70gsm paper
its better to look into machines that have lower cost drums and fusers and that are easy to change like Xerox

 

[AP90]

fuser and drum life will never reach 1,000,000 impressions on any machine ever unless you do not care about quality and only run 70gsm paper
its better to look into machines that have lower cost drums and fusers and that are easy to change like Xerox

Your generous saying that they'll make it 1MIL even if you don't care about quality and only run 70gsm lol.

But really, you'll never get that type of life out of those things. If its a belt fuser, your going to have to replace belts. We probably shred one every 200k or so. Gears will go out before 1 million. Developer housings will wear out. Maybe an indigo 100K will do it for you. But plan on dropping $1.5-2 million on the machine im guessing. So it'd be more beneficial to buy a cheaper machine and repair it when it breaks down.

 

[slimbh]

Thank you AP90 for your answer,

We use in 90% of our work heavy weight paper. The problem on our C1085 is when fuser belt broke on 200k, the technical staff require to change all fuser parts, belt, the three roll, bearing...
This cost too much for us when changing only belt will be much more cheaper.

Also, Ricoh 9200 or Konica c12000 are 1,5 time more expensive than 1085. much less then 1 million$.

 

[slimbh]

By comparing Ricoh and Konica spare part price, we find that Ricoh spare part drum, belt... are much cheaper than Konica spare part price.
But Konica toner Price is cheaper than Ricoh.
Finally, the two brand had nearly the same cost per copy but differently distributed.

 

[Puch]

I guess you're running those machines off-contract. If that's the case, then you'll be better off buying some more KM C1085 machines (el cheapo). Having the same main and backup machines gives you an advantage on everything from toner price to servicing cost. The only other technical aspect to consider is that the Ricoh 9200 has a real straight paper path, unlike the KM C1085. Running heavy stock, that can be a serious advantage.

 

[azehnali]

If you can get service on the Xerox versant 2100 then you should consider that model
Drums are extremely easy to change and so is the fuser belt assembly

 

[bcr]

Looked at the 9200 and was impressed but it's too much machine for our needs. Tech said to me "and it'll do 1m prints in a month if you need it. You'd be seeing us a lot that month, but it'll do it".

 

[azehnali]

they have not made a digital press that will do a million impressions a month or will they ever be able to make one thats toner based
and if you think you can ever do that kind of volume on one then I have a few for sale for you

 

[slimbh]

Actually, We print About 12000K to 20000K sheet per day. So we are over C1085 range and below Ricoh 9200 duty cycle.

No way to buy Xerox machine because of very bad reseller that sell toner very expensive, no technical support.

The only good technical service Available here is Ricoh or Konica reseller.

 

[azehnali]

you will need at least 4-6 machines if you want them to last 5 years

 

[slimbh]

Therefore, as we print mainly heavy weight stock (350G). Our machine and spare part can not last there expected lifetime.

 

[printing4me]

In my experience, if uptime is your priority you need to be considering Canon as well.

 

[Yes U Can]

In my experience, if uptime is your priority you need to be considering Canon as well.

Agree, imagePRESS C910 Series is your partner

 

[pippip]

Agree, imagePRESS C910 Series is your partner

They'd reach that machines monthly limit in a couple of days given the op's volumes.

Think they'd need to be looking a few models above that. Op didn't mention Canon support in their area, might be worth making a few calls.

 

[slimbh]

We have offer from canon V10000 that is equivalent to ricoh 9200. But we heard that inside there is two fuser unit!!!! that can make major issue because we use mainly heavy weight.

 

[jwheeler]

We have offer from canon V10000 that is equivalent to ricoh 9200.

These are not equivalent units:

• The Canon V10000 is 100ppm, standard paper capacity of 2,000 sheets, duplexes up to 350gsm, and duty cycle of 1.5mil.
  
  
• The Ricoh 9200 is 115 ppm, standard paper capacity of 4,400 sheets, duplexes up to 450gsm, and duty cycle of 1.75mil.

 

[azehnali]

numbers sound good
what about reality

 

[[email protected]]

FYI, the Canon V10000 requires 3-Phase 208V/30A, which may be expensive to install and operate.

 

[AP90]

These are not equivalent units:

• The Canon V10000 is 100ppm, standard paper capacity of 2,000 sheets, duplexes up to 350gsm, and duty cycle of 1.5mil.
  
  
• The Ricoh 9200 is 115 ppm, standard paper capacity of 4,400 sheets, duplexes up to 450gsm, and duty cycle of 1.75mil.

I wouldn’t put much stock into the “duty cycle” though. Also remember, duty cycle is single sided 20# 8.5x11. Divide the duty cycle by 4, then divide by 2 and that’s probably what you should be maxing them out a month at