Konica Minolta LU-208XL and SD-513

[jdalsvig]

Hello All,

Does anyone out there use the LU_208XL on their Konica Minolta? We are currently in the process of deciding what KM options to upgrade to at NAU Printing Services and the LU_208XL is one of those options. Are there benefits to it, problems? Does the lack of vacuum feed cause issues? Are there certain types/weights of sheets that don’t work well or work better?

We are also considering upgrading to an SD-513 saddle stitcher. We are currently running an SD-506 saddle stitcher.
Anyone have any advantages or disadvantages for with the SD-513? Anyone work with both the SD-513 and SD-506 and have examples of advantages/disadvantages between the two saddle stitchers?

Anyone willing to help out a fellow printer and have an online meeting about this one? Let me know.

Currently we are running a KM C7100 and a KM C4070 in our shop. These machines have in-line bindery capabilities (FD-503, SD-506) as well as IQ-501, PF-712/PF-707.

Much Appreciated,
Jason

 

[Robohopar]

I was running the 7090…horrible machine (just the engine…nothing to do with the finishers though). Upgraded to the 12000. We are running the sd-513 with the slitter, creaser, face trim and square bind (sorry unsure of the model #’s). Does a decent job I would say. We produce some nice books but it has its share of problems. Most problems occur when you’re “tricking” the machine to do heavier then spec stocks. We get skewing issues that Konica had not been able to help us with since we are out of spec but it’s still decent. Has a bunch of adjustments for you to play with as well.

Picture below is a 24 page booklet running on 100lb silk cover and 100lb silk text for the guts. 12x18 sheets finished all in-line ready to go.

 

[kslight]

I had an SD513 attached to a KM6085 (no longer here), and it was the worse part of an entirely bad machine…not recommended. Never did a consistent / quality job, jammed a lot, every sheet of the machine ran through it even though you weren’t using it..which is a problem when the unit is having problems especially with the slitters, and the techs didn’t seem to know anything about it. Hardly got any value out of a very expensive attachment because every time we fired it up it was a battle regardless of run length.

When we got rid of KM, we ended up buying an offline booklet maker instead of another inline…duplo dbm150 with the face trimmer…and honestly that thing is nearly perfect for us, never has any problems, much faster than inline, way more flexible for book sizes, will easily last decades.

 

[jdalsvig]

I was running the 7090…horrible machine (just the engine…nothing to do with the finishers though). Upgraded to the 12000. We are running the sd-513 with the slitter, creaser, face trim and square bind (sorry unsure of the model #’s). Does a decent job I would say. We produce some nice books but it has its share of problems. Most problems occur when you’re “tricking” the machine to do heavier then spec stocks. We get skewing issues that Konica had not been able to help us with since we are out of spec but it’s still decent. Has a bunch of adjustments for you to play with as well.

Picture below is a 24 page booklet running on 100lb silk cover and 100lb silk text for the guts. 12x18 sheets finished all in-line ready to go.

View attachment 293871

Skewing issues with stock that was out of spec - out of spec in what way? Weight? Grain direction? Was there a difference in performance between coated and uncoated stocks?

 

[jdalsvig]

I had an SD513 attached to a KM6085 (no longer here), and it was the worse part of an entirely bad machine…not recommended. Never did a consistent / quality job, jammed a lot, every sheet of the machine ran through it even though you weren’t using it..which is a problem when the unit is having problems especially with the slitters, and the techs didn’t seem to know anything about it. Hardly got any value out of a very expensive attachment because every time we fired it up it was a battle regardless of run length.

When we got rid of KM, we ended up buying an offline booklet maker instead of another inline…duplo dbm150 with the face trimmer…and honestly that thing is nearly perfect for us, never has any problems, much faster than inline, way more flexible for book sizes, will easily last decades.

Slitter problems - were you having problems with slitters when they weren't being used? Example - on jobs where the SD-513 wasn't being used and jobs were run through it were slitters causing problems? Please describe.
I've had jamming problems with the SD-506 that I work with when it wasn't being used and jobs were running through it to the delivery tray, usually it can be solved by changing the curl of the paper stock before it gets fed or by using the RU-518 to change the curl the engine puts on the stock.

 

[kslight]

Slitter problems - were you having problems with slitters when they weren't being used? Example - on jobs where the SD-513 wasn't being used and jobs were run through it were slitters causing problems? Please describe.
I've had jamming problems with the SD-506 that I work with when it wasn't being used and jobs were running through it to the delivery tray, usually it can be solved by changing the curl of the paper stock before it gets fed or by using the RU-518 to change the curl the engine puts on the stock.

Yes, even if you weren’t using them, every sheet passes through the slitters. They would mechanically open and close per sheet based on sheet size. If it didn’t quite open enough, it would cut off pieces of your sheets / envelopes and or jam. It was as I said, a poor design. And when you do use the slitters intentionally, the quality of the slit was often not up to our standards…rough, cracked appearance, inconsistent.

 

[jwheeler]

Most problems occur when you’re “tricking” the machine to do heavier then spec stocks

Same here

We get skewing issues that Konica had not been able to help us with

Same here

we ended up buying an offline booklet maker instead of another inline

We're going to do the same when we upgrade...looking at either the Duplos or Plockmatics.

it would cut off pieces of your sheets / envelopes and or jam

We've had this issue several times too. Causes alot of frustration looking for that cut off piece and usually takes the machine down until a tech can come find it.

 

[jwheeler]

Does the lack of vacuum feed cause issues?

Lack of vacuum feed can cause feeding issues on any press. That's why nearly every manufacturer has upgraded paper feed drawers which have vacuum belts for feeding instead of friction tires. The tires will become slick and start misfeeding over time, especially with glossy media. If you plan on doing alot of banner sized sheets, get the PF-812 so you get 3 vacuum feed drawers that support banner and smaller sheets. If it's minimal use, then get the PF-712 (3 vacuum drawers), and add the MB-511 (bypass tray) with the banner feed kit to the top of it. That's what we have on our KM C7090. It works fine, but we do have to regularly clean the feed tires.

 

[Robohopar]

Skewing issues with stock that was out of spec - out of spec in what way? Weight? Grain direction? Was there a difference in performance between coated and uncoated stocks?

I print a lot of books that have about 15-20 20lb 11x17 sheets (no slitting) with a 80lb gloss cover wrapping it up. I know offine would work better but the ease of use here is too convenient for us.

We constantly have jobs that are 100lb gloss text - some have a 100lb gloss cover and some are self cover (with slit). Even with these we do not have many issues except for it’s passable skewing.

I recently had a job with silk text with a silk cover and had issues there for some reason. Not sure if it’s the static or less grippy paper?

To answer your question, Most of what I run is out of spec so I can’t complain much. Even the runs that are within specs, I still get skewing a bit but again…it’s passable.