Ricoh vs Cannon vs Xerox Quality...

[kdw75]

I have run Xerox Versant machines for 5 years and Ricoh's 7210s for 4 years. Registration and print quality are much better on the Ricohs. Especially screens. That being said, I wonder how the Cannon compares. Has anyone had experience with all three brands and a similar level of machine?

Someone near us put in an Iridesse when it first came out and even it doesn't print screens as well as our Ricoh 7210. The black screens look....dirty.

 

[kslight]

Canon to me has a very enamel-y quality to it, similar to the old fuser oil using machines. At least that’s what I got from the brief demo a few years ago.

 

[TJPrinter]

The level of gloss can be reduced and it’s actually pretty low on uncoated stock but it’s definitely more gloss than your Versant and I didn’t really care for the higher gloss. On paper the Canon new V series looks like it improved some of the shortfalls of Canon like crappy registration from sheet to sheet and front to back but someone else will have to chime in because these are brand new.

At least on this board, it seems like users are migrating to Ricoh and either Canon is rock solid and users don’t need assistance or there aren’t many Canon users on this board. You don’t see too many posts on Canon.

 

[kslight]

The level of gloss can be reduced and it’s actually pretty low on uncoated stock but it’s definitely more gloss than your Versant and I didn’t really care for the higher gloss. On paper the Canon new V series looks like it improved some of the shortfalls of Canon like crappy registration from sheet to sheet and front to back but someone else will have to chime in because these are brand new.

At least on this board, it seems like users are migrating to Ricoh and either Canon is rock solid and users don’t need assistance or there aren’t many Canon users on this board. You don’t see too many posts on Canon.

In my area I just don’t see a big canon presence in cut size commercial printing. I don’t think we even have a direct Canon channel, i would have to purchase from third party. I think they may have a better presence at churches / hospital in plant type places, where I’ve seen them. And this makes sense, their machines seem to be designed to be very dumbed down easy to use. When I tried to obtain competitive quotes from the dealer a few years ago I couldn’t even get one, they wanted to sell us Konica instead.

 

[Bill Ward]

The level of gloss can be reduced and it’s actually pretty low on uncoated stock but it’s definitely more gloss than your Versant and I didn’t really care for the higher gloss. On paper the Canon new V series looks like it improved some of the shortfalls of Canon like crappy registration from sheet to sheet and front to back but someone else will have to chime in because these are brand new.

At least on this board, it seems like users are migrating to Ricoh and either Canon is rock solid and users don’t need assistance or there aren’t many Canon users on this board. You don’t see too many posts on Canon.

Yeah, I don't see many Canon posts here either. (I've always wondered why) I've been working on Canon imagepress machines for about 9 years now, from the old 5000 series, to the 8000s to our new V series. Each new generation tends to be a big step up. As far as the topic here, I can't say much in comparison to Ricoh or Xerox. I can only say what I do and don't like about Canon.

 

[namelessentity]

Yeah, I don't see many Canon posts here either. (I've always wondered why) I've been working on Canon imagepress machines for about 9 years now, from the old 5000 series, to the 8000s to our new V series. Each new generation tends to be a big step up. As far as the topic here, I can't say much in comparison to Ricoh or Xerox. I can only say what I do and don't like about Canon.

I feel like the 6000/7000 had a lot of problems, so a lot of shops jumped ship. I pretty much hated running our 6010 near the end since I was constantly getting tail end fading and it printed terribly on uncoated stocks.
We're running a 1000 currently, and will likely upgrade to the V series this winter. How do you like it so far?

 

[afilsonCSA]

Hi All, I am the Sr. Director for Professional Services at Canon Solutions America specifically in the Production Printing Division. I would be happy to show you Canon quality on different stocks/files and connect you with a Canon salesperson to see if we can help. Our IX series of sheetfed printers has made significant progress in commercial printing and book printing, as has our Prostream line of products. As a matter of fact one of the largest book printers in the world uses Canon presses for all of their output. We have also produced a book that is printed in both offset and inkjet where we ask the reader to identify which pages are from what process. The quality of our devices not only compares to offset, but exceeds it; in addition our Prostream devices actually have a larger color gamut than offset.

You can also find some more information here:

Home

thINK is a community of Canon Production Print customers, led by some of the most successful inkjet service providers in the country.

www.thinkforum.com

 

[Bill Ward]

I feel like the 6000/7000 had a lot of problems, so a lot of shops jumped ship. I pretty much hated running our 6010 near the end since I was constantly getting tail end fading and it printed terribly on uncoated stocks.
We're running a 1000 currently, and will likely upgrade to the V series this winter. How do you like it so far?

We just go it, but I like it so far (fingers crossed). Coverage on coated seems good and it feeds stocks that typically gave us issues (like adhesive stocks) very well and it will run up to 400 gsm. I actually haven't had a chance to check how it does on uncoated stocks. Do any machines get great coverage on uncoated besides super smooth Hammermill? Let me know if you have experience with a machine that does.
I'm most curious how the V series will handle those mid-tone values (blue greys and such). Those have been my biggest frustration with the older machines.

 

[Craig]

Our Ricoh 9200 and 7200 print much better than our old 1000i and V180. A lot less gloss differential and much finer screens.

 

[Magnus59]

Yeah, I don't see many Canon posts here either. (I've always wondered why) I've been working on Canon imagepress machines for about 9 years now, from the old 5000 series, to the 8000s to our new V series. Each new generation tends to be a big step up. As far as the topic here, I can't say much in comparison to Ricoh or Xerox. I can only say what I do and don't like about Canon.

I had a Canon CLC-1 back in 1989, we were selling A3 single sided colour copies for $15 and A4 for $10. It was illegal to make double sided colour copies at the time in case someone tried to copy currency. I haven't seen a Canon production machine since then.

 

[Yes U Can]

Print quality, consistency, productivity and registration are key words for new V-series at Canon.
Print quality because all of the models have internal spectrophotometersensor installed for calibration, validation and more automation on operator tasks.
Consistency as colour density is continuously measured for each color in 20/40/60/80/100% and corrected if needed.
Maybe not always the fastest engines in its segment but on productivity almost unbeatable, also as automation of tasks and ease of use being implemented.
For registration.... 0,8 mm front to back the best of all vendors, or even less than 0,8 mm for the higher positioned machines.

Hope you have some background for Canon in this thread. I'm a product manager in The Netherlands for Canon Professional Print.

 

[pippip]

Print quality, consistency, productivity and registration are key words for new V-series at Canon.
Print quality because all of the models have internal spectrophotometersensor installed for calibration, validation and more automation on operator tasks.
Consistency as colour density is continuously measured for each color in 20/40/60/80/100% and corrected if needed.
Maybe not always the fastest engines in its segment but on productivity almost unbeatable, also as automation of tasks and ease of use being implemented.
For registration.... 0,8 mm front to back the best of all vendors, or even less than 0,8 mm for the higher positioned machines.

Hope you have some background for Canon in this thread. I'm a product manager in The Netherlands for Canon Professional Print.

I know you mean well but in a crowd of printer operators that sales spiel means absolutely nothing.
We have all received the exact same with every machine we've bought what've you've listed is probably in the brochure of all models in question.
OP and others are looking for real world use and not so much what it can do but more what it can't do which won't be found in your sales brochures.

 

[Make_It_So]

Hi All, I am the Sr. Director for Professional Services at Canon Solutions America specifically in the Production Printing Division. I would be happy to show you Canon quality on different stocks/files and connect you with a Canon salesperson to see if we can help. Our IX series of sheetfed printers has made significant progress in commercial printing and book printing, as has our Prostream line of products. As a matter of fact one of the largest book printers in the world uses Canon presses for all of their output. We have also produced a book that is printed in both offset and inkjet where we ask the reader to identify which pages are from what process. The quality of our devices not only compares to offset, but exceeds it; in addition our Prostream devices actually have a larger color gamut than offset.

You can also find some more information here:

Home

thINK is a community of Canon Production Print customers, led by some of the most successful inkjet service providers in the country.

www.thinkforum.com

Can a iX series device meet G7 standards? It would be incredibly nice if we can come come close to our G7 commercial presses with a digital press.

 

[Ynot_UK]

Print quality, consistency, productivity and registration are key words for new V-series at Canon.
Print quality because all of the models have internal spectrophotometersensor installed for calibration, validation and more automation on operator tasks.
Consistency as colour density is continuously measured for each color in 20/40/60/80/100% and corrected if needed.
Maybe not always the fastest engines in its segment but on productivity almost unbeatable, also as automation of tasks and ease of use being implemented.
For registration.... 0,8 mm front to back the best of all vendors, or even less than 0,8 mm for the higher positioned machines.

Hope you have some background for Canon in this thread. I'm a product manager in The Netherlands for Canon Professional Print.

All manufacturers will have their own "key words" and sales pitches, however the only thing that counts is you running a decent number of your own various jobs on your own substrates and deciding what's good, what's bad and what's ugly.

 

[namelessentity]

I would love an iX, but last i heard they're in the 1million dollar range.

Also, for what it's worth, Canon's production printers register to a corner, so they back up much more reliably than other digital printers.

 

[afilsonCSA]

Can a iX series device meet G7 standards? It would be incredibly nice if we can come come close to our G7 commercial presses with a digital press.

Absolutely:

Canon Achieves Idealliance® Digital Press System Certifications for Its iX Series Inkjet Printing Presses - Idealliance

Canon has achieved the Digital Press-Inkjet certification for its varioPRINT iX-series (iX3200 & iX2100), ProStream 1000 series, and ColorStream 8000 series, as well as ISO/PAS 15339 System Certification for its varioPRINT iX-series (iX3200 & iX2100) and ProStream 1000 series.

idealliance.org

 

[Make_It_So]

Absolutely:

Canon Achieves Idealliance® Digital Press System Certifications for Its iX Series Inkjet Printing Presses - Idealliance

Canon has achieved the Digital Press-Inkjet certification for its varioPRINT iX-series (iX3200 & iX2100), ProStream 1000 series, and ColorStream 8000 series, as well as ISO/PAS 15339 System Certification for its varioPRINT iX-series (iX3200 & iX2100) and ProStream 1000 series.

idealliance.org

Excellent. Thank you for this. I will added to my arsenal.

 

[Make_It_So]

Absolutely:

Canon Achieves Idealliance® Digital Press System Certifications for Its iX Series Inkjet Printing Presses - Idealliance

Canon has achieved the Digital Press-Inkjet certification for its varioPRINT iX-series (iX3200 & iX2100), ProStream 1000 series, and ColorStream 8000 series, as well as ISO/PAS 15339 System Certification for its varioPRINT iX-series (iX3200 & iX2100) and ProStream 1000 series.

idealliance.org

One more question. Can the iX series print on chromatography substrates? We currently have to print on our Wide Format equipment.

 

[afilsonCSA]

One more question. Can the iX series print on chromatography substrates? We currently have to print on our Wide Format equipment.

Can you send me the specifics on your substrate(s)? [email protected]

 

[YourCastle]

i've used the ricoh 7100 series and xerox v80 and v180 extensively. They're similar enough to me, except my current v180 does a far superior job of flood colors than the ricohs I used.