scuffing/toner melting while mailing

[jrsc]

We've had a lot of problems with postcards we mail for customers getting destroyed in the mail. We use primarily Ricoh equipment but from the testing I've done it doesn't seem to matter. Some will just be small scuffs but through testing and talks with the post office we are finding a lot of it is actually so much friction in the postal equipment that the toner is actually melting and then smearing across the card. When I tested using a heat gun and an inferred temp gun I determined they are heating to over 350 degrees to cause this. We've tried UV coating and it's helped some but has not solved the problem. We have customers that are ready to quit mailing because their mailings don't look good when they get to their customer. The post office has been absolutely no help. Does anybody have any suggestions?

 

[mojoprime]

just a thought, you might see if anyone local has a different machine, like a xerox or canon, and try your heat gun method and see if it's the toner or temp.

if it's the temp, at least you have empirical evidence to take to the post office. they might not do anything but you can bring it to their attention. i know it's getting really hot where i'm at and the humidity is very high but it might not be that way where you are.

 

[printing656]

It seems very difficult to believe that equipment in the postal stream would do anything near that temperature without burning an entire building down. I can't see why they would need anything that hot either. In my experience, I've witnessed what I'd call ghosting problems caused by 2 different issues.

We've had a ghosting problem when the digital printer that was printing on cardstock did not have the proper media weight selected. This was a cheat we were using to allow the printer to print cards faster. Once we upped the media weight and that slowed the machine down, then the problem went away.
The other issue is not as easy to solve in your situation. We were seeing a problem where the USPS sorting belts had so much tension on the mail pieces that it was smashing the security tint from the envelope onto the contents inside. It was and still is coming from only 1 USPS facility that I'm aware of. We changed our security design and that seems to have solved it for our mail pieces.

 

[dabob]

jrsc . . .

in my experience different postal processing centers treat mail differently - it might be the maintenance guys at one place are better than another and their machines are tuned to treat mail nicely - if you have a different mail drop center in the area you might try it - how does the conventionally printed material go through your post office - if it screws that up too it probably isn't a toner issue . . .

but IMHO the post office exists just to destroy the mail piece you just worked so hard to produce - just think - if their machines can get through UV coating and reach the temps you are talking about something just aint right

 

[edocpublish.com]

i have the same problem that you have. My own mailing is getting damaged.
I will be sending the next mailing using Lamination on both sides.

I am using Xerox 700 for printing.

UV did not help.

 

[jrsc]

The post office called it belt burn. They basically said when it goes through their machines they have a belt spinning against a non moving piece. The friction from the spinning belt causes heat.

 

[dabob]

That would be like a friction feed folder, perforator, scorer, etc . . . can you see any of us getting away with that when our customer complained??????

 

[mojoprime]

so, you're supposed to compensate for that? good lord. sounds like need a belt change...

 

[dabob]

so, you're supposed to compensate for that? good lord. sounds like need a belt change...

you can't compensate for that - it's a maintenance/adjustment issue

 

[arossetti]

UV coat has been the traditional remedy for this. However if that didn't fix the problem I'm not sure of a solution. I've yet to see a digital piece in my area get through the post office un-damaged from scuff marks.

Some printers do put a thinner amount of toner down then others which can cause this to be more noticeable; but it is a pretty universal problem.

 

[msaeger]

What model Ricoh?

 

[Possumgal]

i have the same problem that you have. My own mailing is getting damaged.
I will be sending the next mailing using Lamination on both sides.

I am using Xerox 700 for printing.

UV did not help.

i have the same problem that you have. My own mailing is getting damaged.
I will be sending the next mailing using Lamination on both sides.

I am using Xerox 700 for printing.

The Xerox 700 uses a low melt toner. Another machine that uses another kind of toner can help slightly along with the UV coating.

 

[MailGuru]

I don't think the problem is unique to digital print. I have received offset printed pieces at the house with the same scuff marks. It's probably an operator (postal employee) issue. With the USPS trying to do more, with less people, I think they are emphasizing speed over good workmanship. I would bet that the postal employee that operates the sorters has the ability to slow the speed so that mail doesn't get damaged, but then, they might not meet their per-piece quota on their shift (if there is one). With postal management actively looking for any reason to terminate an employee, that could be disasterous.

Sorting your mail to the finest sort level might help some. That way, your mail stays in the mail trays until it reaches it's final destination. Other than that, I don't know what else can be done.

-MailGuru

 

[jrsc]

What model Ricoh?

651 and 901

 

[msaeger]

651 and 901

Have you tried upping the fuser temp? You can set the temp higher than what the machine runs at when set to weight 7 by creating a custom paper. You can also increase the fusing nip and slow down the printing. Not sure if anything will help stand up to the postal machines but it's something else to try if you haven't done so already.

 

[jrsc]

Have you tried upping the fuser temp? You can set the temp higher than what the machine runs at when set to weight 7 by creating a custom paper. You can also increase the fusing nip and slow down the printing. Not sure if anything will help stand up to the postal machines but it's something else to try if you haven't done so already.

Hi have tried upping the fuser temp to the max in the advance paper settings. I have not tried slowing it down but I don't think it will help because it's not an adhesion problem. I've tried just about everything to scuff or scratch the toner and it is adhered very well but when you heat it past its melting point it will wipe away if you wipe over it with your finger.

 

[dennis.matl]

We have similar issues with our postcards.

What I have determined is that the damage is caused at the delivery sort location. Based on mail returned to our location and damaged pieces that have been returned by the recipient.

We have cards that have been sent to China and been returned that show less damage than the ones sent domestically.