Toner getting smeared at the post office

[raminmd]

Hi all,

I am sorry if this is not the right place but I was curious on how everyone handled the issue of toner getting smeared when it goes through the sorting equipment in the post office.

I know digital printing in general has this issue. However, is UV coating the only solution. Not only does it add significant time to the turnarounds but it is also not very environmentally friendly.

We have a Canon 7000VP and we do have the issue of the toner getting smeared on the postcards when they go through the postal system. It is random but it does happen more than we want. I know other printers in the area who have IGENs and they have the same issue as well. I am assuming that most digital printers have this issue.

Most of our stuff is run on 12 pt. glossy stock.

Thanks.

 

[ROCPrinter]

Yes, it will happen with an iGen, Indigo, Nexpress or any other digital device. UV coating is about the only fast option... You could varnish the sheets on an offset press but then you will need drying time. You have to seal the sheets.

I bought a 25" UV coater (without the feeder) relatively cheap from Tec Lighting (Tec Lighting). I ran a shop that had two HP Indigo's and this machine suited them well and my customers where happy. I would buy another one in a heartbeat!

 

[Rhino]

Environmentally-Friendly UV Coating

Environmentally-Friendly UV Coating

Raminmd,

Sealing the sheet is your best option to prevent future smearing. You had mentioned UV coating, our UV coatings are environmentally-friendly, pressman-friendly and ODOR-FREE.

Please visit our web site Welcome To Rhino Performance Products or call us @ 866-601-6241

 

[lfelton]

My experience is different. On K-M and Xerox colour machines, the rub resistance is very high on all the paper we use and we've never had to coat a sheet for that reason. The only time I can remember ever getting an issue with rubbing, it turned out that some sheets of heavier paper had been mixed in somehow and therefore the fuser wasn't hot enough for those sheets.

I've heard that the print on Indigos can be a bit fragile and there are various discussions (i.e. ink laydown order) on how to improve this.

I don't know about Canons, but IMO you should investigate whether you are getting the best rub resistance your machine can produce before looking at coating.

 

[X33]

I've seen 2 solutions:

1. Put UV coating on the pieces mailed.

2. Use the highest level of automation and bar codes that the USPS needs so that the pieces don't need to go through sorting machines; they go straight to the delivery carriers. Check with the USPS.

 

[Craig]

X33 - #2 will only apply if you are doing a saturation mailing.

One thing we need to remember and inform our customers. The USPS is sorting at something like 12 pieces per SECOND. There is a great amount of friction when the machine is separating the pieces. I get offset printed pieces all the time that have the same amount or even more smearing than digital prints. We are not the only ones plagued with this problem, it effects everyone.

 

[Pirate Mike]

I concur UV coating is the best method to protect sheets being mailed. I will caution you that just recently there have been quite a few very inexpensive units put out on the market that have shortened the dwell time by reducing the overall length of their units to fit small spaces and pocketbooks, but have severly reduced the quality of the overall coating.

The only "entry" level unit that I have seen work successfully is the TecLighting unit. Another benefit to them is that they make their own coatings so you can be assured that they will work as planned. Over the years selling Konica Minolta (C500, C5500, C6500, C65hc), Canon ImagePRESS's and later Ricoh C900's TecLighting has been the most consistent for the price. If you are in a mixed environment you may have to have several solutions. For example end up with a Canon and a Konica Minolta due to the differences in their toner.

I have used several other brands in my solutions just to be dissapointed. Just my 2 cents worth...

 

[Steve_S]

Craig is right - we have a bin we keep just to show clients who become upset when this happens. We have examples of offset printed, UV coated cards that are burnt through into the paper. It is not just a digital problem - it is a USPS impatience problem.

 

[alan4color]

Like craig i have seen litho cards damaged. I sometimes think the post office uses a belt sander in the sort machines. While we do not have a UV coated on site we have had good luck running indigo work through our litho press and applying an AQ coating to seal.

Its a matter of determining clients needs and getting expectations in line with reality.

 

[KurtK]

The IPA evaluated rub resistance and cracking in their Digital Print Forum Tests in 2008 and 2009.

In 2008, the entrants selected their own paper for the test. In the rub test, prints from the Heidelberg XL 105 and Indigo 3050, 5000, & 5500 lost 50% or more of their density, whereas the NexPress S3000, KM 6500 and Xeikon 6000 and 8000 only lost 20% or less of their original density.

In 2009, the same paper was used by all entrants, so the test may not show the best a system can do. Print samples from the Indigo 7000, Presstek 52DI, Sceen Truepress 344, and the iGen4 lost 40% or more of their density. Print samples from the Canon C7000, NexPress S3000, and Xeikon 3300 & 8000 only lost around 20% or less of their original density. The print samples from Xeikon 8000 did the best with only 10% density loss.

Bottom line is one can get very good rub resistance with many of the digital presses w/o coating the output. There were no print samples using ink that did well in the test, so offset generally needs to be coated. Check with your vendor for the best media and make sure you’re using the appropriate fuser/paper settings.

 

[teclighting]

The truth about UV

The truth about UV

Thank you to those that had positive things to say about the Tec Lighting product, it means a lot to both Tec Lighting and myself.

I would like to comment on the safety of UV.

1. All of the UV coatings offered by Tec Lighting are 99.9% VOC free.
2. Paper that is UV Coated is recyclable.
3. The only by-product of the entire system in operation is small amounts of Ozone that can be easily vented into room with ample airflow or out of the building.

A great article about this was written by Gary Cohen
RadTech North America International. It's very informative.

If you have any questions please contact me at [email protected]

Daniel

 

[thomasblessing]

UV coating

UV coating

Contact me for information on the TEC Lighting XtraCoat UV coaters and coatings
[email protected]

 

[FKarlone]

Turn up the voltage

Turn up the voltage

I have a canon c6000

You can try to turn up the voltage through "Paper type management"

You will need to make a custom sheet.

You could also try "register paper" and pick a "heavy 6"

Both of these will "turn up the heat"!

Karl jennex

 

[PDeuth]

It's the system

It's the system

I just finished doing a bit of consulting at a direct mail plant. The toner from their laser printers was tracking and smearing on their sheeter-folder lines. This happened with only some jobs, and on those jobs, only on some of the paper rolls. That's interesting.

I did improve their bindery equipment and make it less abusive along the way. The toner-paper interaction problem demanded resources they were/are not willing to commit. However, it looks like the paper fibers on some rolls are more likely to break loose, and the toner stack with them. Too, they are using old equipment, reconditioned printer drums, and high settings to compensate for that, so the toner stacks are prone to breakage, anyhow.

As it happens, some paper is too porous, and some paper is not porous enough, kind of like Goldilocks' story. It's, well, a bear to deal with.
Here are links to some YouTube videos on this subject.
YouTube - web-ready DMS clips
YouTube - 2010_03_01_071753.mov

That letter "a" is 8 point.

 

[mannyC]

Yes, it will happen with an iGen, Indigo, Nexpress or any other digital device. UV coating is about the only fast option... You could varnish the sheets on an offset press but then you will need drying time. You have to seal the sheets.

I bought a 25" UV coater (without the feeder) relatively cheap from Tec Lighting (Tec Lighting). I ran a shop that had two HP Indigo's and this machine suited them well and my customers where happy. I would buy another one in a heartbeat!

I am glad to hear of your positive experience with Tec Lighting units. Call me when you're readey to buy another unit.

mannyc
714-529-5068

 

[idadunit]

Temparature controls for imagePRESS C7000VP

Temparature controls for imagePRESS C7000VP

You can help your toner stick harder to the page by using the Gloss setting in the paper catalogue.
Setting the Gloss to +2 will ad an extra 30 degress to the fuser temps. This will help the toner stick to the page better.
The best solution is still UV coating

 

[cmitchprint]

We've had great luck laminating KM toner with standard gloss laminate. It's amazing how the post office insists that you conform to their inadequacies instead of them updating their equipment to today's standards.

 

[Craig]

Guys (girls too) it's ABSOLUTELY not a problem of toner STICKING to the sheet. It's a matter of friction from the USPS mail sorting machine PERIOD! It effects almost every type of printed piece (digital and litho). The UV coating simply takes the abuse saving the print. Take time and go through the mail, look at both sides of the piece.

 

[raminmd]

Karl, We actually use coated 7 paper type in the 7000 and in fact because of the paper we use (300 GSM glossy stock), we have the secondary voltage turned up to 6. It still rubs off. I completely agree with Craig. It is a post office issue. We complained so much o the post office that the manager invited us to come to the local bulk mail facility. I actually went there along with my production manager. We took samples that they ran through the mail sorting machine in front of us. The toner rubbed off every single piece. Their reaction.......they just shrugged and said we need to coat our pieces or start sending letters. The guy who ran the pieces through made it very clear that there was nothing they could do and seemed irritated that we were even there.

 

[pschill2]

Hi all,

I am sorry if this is not the right place but I was curious on how everyone handled the issue of toner getting smeared when it goes through the sorting equipment in the post office.

I know digital printing in general has this issue. However, is UV coating the only solution. Not only does it add significant time to the turnarounds but it is also not very environmentally friendly.

We have a Canon 7000VP and we do have the issue of the toner getting smeared on the postcards when they go through the postal system. It is random but it does happen more than we want. I know other printers in the area who have IGENs and they have the same issue as well. I am assuming that most digital printers have this issue.

Most of our stuff is run on 12 pt. glossy stock.

Thanks.

Here is a link to a summary of the print study (Survivability of Print in the Postal Stream). You need to be a member to download the actual report. This link is available to the public:

http://www.graphicsoftheamericas.com/assets/pdfs/Session36Presentation.pdf

Paul Schiller, Kodak Digital Print Solutions