UV Coating equipment

[bhm8hwcm]

I will be in the market soon for an offline UV coater and wanted to see if people out there had any feedback on machines etc.

A few years ago (3) when I went to Graph Expo there were only a couple of suppliers with coaters and now it seems like everybody has one. Back then it seemed like the long conveyor was important for flow out on the coating and now many conveyors are shorter...or even non existent. Equipment vendors say the coatings have changed so this is not necessary anymore. Companies like Tec Lighting and FMA (some of the originals guys in it) have not done away with their conveyors so is this due to the fact you really do need the long conveyor, or are they just not adapting/keeping up with the times?

I spoke with a Duplo dealer as well about their machine and it looks quite good but costs quite a bit more.

I presently do AQ on cards and personally am not a big fan of UV as I prefer the look of gloss AQ. I also need things to be writeable as many people want to be able to write on the cards. I do understand there is some writeable UV coatings as well as less glossy coatings available. I am getting some samples done up.

Any thoughts.

 

[Craig]

I was pretty impressed with Tec Lighting at Graph Expo this year, very simple and easy to operate.

 

[Internal_R&D_Analyst]

If the coating machine has IR on it the convener can be shorter and still give good results.

 

[Mike Barisonek]

UV coating equipment

UV coating equipment

One of the key changes in UV coating over the last few years is the use of Anilox metering systems versus roller metering.

All the high end offset presses that coat in line use Anilox versus roller metering, because it is more user friendly, more repeatable ,and applies satin, matte and specialty coatings without streaking.

Coating formulations have improved substantially also, so that flow out is not nearly the problem it
has been in the past.

Visit Epic Products International, Inc. [ Coaters - Delta Dampening System - and more... ] for more information on Anilox versus roller metering and it's application
on Digital and offset output

 

[fmatheus]

My Name is Frank Matheus and I am VP of Sales for FMA.

The flow out issue is being debated and will be debated for many years.

Bottom line Flow out is based on the viscosity of the fluid. Manufactures like Kelstar and Nicoat are manufacturing fluids at a much lower viscosity then they previously did. With these lower viscosities flow out takes less time then it did before.

If any one has questions regarding equipment or capabilities of U.V. please call me at 949-697-0502

 

[ballykea]

UV Varnish

UV Varnish

FYI- IR dryer does not work on UV and will do nothing to shorten table. It is used only for drying Aqueous coatings. UV is cured not dried.

If the coating machine has IR on it the convener can be shorter and still give good results.

 

[fmatheus]

You are correct that UV Coating is cured and not dried. Although IR does help with shorting the conveyor because IR will allow the coating to flow out quicker. There are 2 ways to assist in flow out:

1) Time----The longer it takes the sheet to see the lamp the smoother the coating will be.

2) Heat-----Heat will allow the coating to flow out faster in turn giving you a smoother coating. So heat can shorten the dwell time between the coating head and the lamp.

 

[Internal_R&D_Analyst]

Thanks Frank, what you said is what I was implying.

Most of us realize UV coating needs Ultra Violet light to cure.

 

[digital-labels]

UV Coater

UV Coater

If you have an email to forward_ I can send you a quick video 18" feed small footprint hand feed or auto ahndfeed is $9999 FOB Grand Rapids, MI.
We have coated primarily glossy-matte finish may be writable glossy is not.
Our main emphasis has been on coating digital output.

We are a dealer for Nicoat too-they are the best.
email to :[email protected]

I will be in the market soon for an offline UV coater and wanted to see if people out there had any feedback on machines etc.

A few years ago (3) when I went to Graph Expo there were only a couple of suppliers with coaters and now it seems like everybody has one. Back then it seemed like the long conveyor was important for flow out on the coating and now many conveyors are shorter...or even non existent. Equipment vendors say the coatings have changed so this is not necessary anymore. Companies like Tec Lighting and FMA (some of the originals guys in it) have not done away with their conveyors so is this due to the fact you really do need the long conveyor, or are they just not adapting/keeping up with the times?

I spoke with a Duplo dealer as well about their machine and it looks quite good but costs quite a bit more.

I presently do AQ on cards and personally am not a big fan of UV as I prefer the look of gloss AQ. I also need things to be writeable as many people want to be able to write on the cards. I do understand there is some writeable UV coatings as well as less glossy coatings available. I am getting some samples done up.

Any thoughts.

 

[OutSourceD]

We are looking for a UV coater that will lay a coat on output from the Bizhub 6500.

 

[fmatheus]

We have partnered with Konica Minolta to solve the C6500 Toner issues. Please give me a call to discuss what we have done.

Frank Matheus 949-697-0502

 

[digital-labels]

6500 coating

6500 coating

If you would like to send samples from your output we will coat them for you on our new veri-coat 1800. (hand feed) We have the units for sale and they work extremely well. The KM 650 and 6500 have been tricky until our new uv solution.
Cost for machine is $9999 fob Grand Rapids, Mi coating material for 6500 is $280 plus UPS for 5 gallons which will cover about 32-35M 12 X 18 sheets. Let me know if you would like our address-also email and we can send you a 1-1/2 min video of machine.

Thanks,
Jim

We are looking for a UV coater that will lay a coat on output from the Bizhub 6500.

 

[Bondmaster]

Depending on quantity and size of runs, you could always look at lamination of films versus UV coatings. Laminators come in tiny footprint models these days. No odor, no protective gear needed, no cracking, 10 min set up & no "wash down", switch off and walk away, no specific operator training, damage a roller -- $500 -- damage a UV roller $2000, no UV lamp life of "ex life" at $1000's??? to worry about, product that customers can feel the added value, what you see on sampling is what you get, write on --write off films that have been around for 30 years, etc etc.
Laminators start at $5000 to $30000 to get value on short runs. Huge runs take a laminator in the bracket of $30000 to $100000. UV starts around $25000 but goes to $400000 if you are serious.
I sell both , but know that lamination is put down by the coating brigade, but still is a cost effective system for short runs. Best I see on UV is to get something that does more than just flood coat ie: like a Kompac that can flood, spot , scratchy, aqueous as well as UV. They have me worried if it wasn't for the high price compared with laminators

 

[fsdoc]

This is a vendor response. Prisco (Printer's Service) does sell an offline UV coater. There is an extensive list of options available as well. They are also a coating manufacturer so specialty coatings are available.

 

[Internal_R&D_Analyst]

Depending on quantity and size of runs, you could always look at lamination of films versus UV coatings. Laminators come in tiny footprint models these days. No odor, no protective gear needed, no cracking, 10 min set up & no "wash down", switch off and walk away, no specific operator training, damage a roller -- $500 -- damage a UV roller $2000, no UV lamp life of "ex life" at $1000's??? to worry about, product that customers can feel the added value, what you see on sampling is what you get, write on --write off films that have been around for 30 years, etc etc.
Laminators start at $5000 to $30000 to get value on short runs. Huge runs take a laminator in the bracket of $30000 to $100000. UV starts around $25000 but goes to $400000 if you are serious.
I sell both , but know that lamination is put down by the coating brigade, but still is a cost effective system for short runs. Best I see on UV is to get something that does more than just flood coat ie: like a Kompac that can flood, spot , scratchy, aqueous as well as UV. They have me worried if it wasn't for the high price compared with laminators

Since you have both can you comment on the price difference on the consumables for coating vs film? How many sheets does it take for the higher cost of the UV machine to offset the ongoing higher cost of the film?

 

[Bondmaster]

Can be a very extensive and complex answer as volume has a lot to do with it. Maybe I start at the "baby" end of the market that has runs coming off laser & digital printers in low quantity, high value , just in time, that face many today.
1...A laminator worth $15000 -- Can get cheaper , but this represents moderate to low speed devices.
2...A UV line worth $30000 -- I think this relatively low $'s & most out there are $20000 more.

Maintanence cost on the laminator should be exactly zero other than some grease. Things that get ruined by operator lapses cost peanuts. UV machine can be costly in comparison. A laminator in full flight consumes about 2/3 less power than a UV coater. A laminator requires no special concerns re hazardous goods handling, ventilation, can generally be wheeled around, has 1/2 the footprint and so on. These opinions can be shot down by not comparing apple with apples , but overall they are correct.

Please take into account I'm down under with maybe somewhat different values , but read as a numerical comparison only. I've attempted to convert to US thinking as I export 90% of my production in laminators there and do have a feel for some of the market there. I've been a laminator from Flexo days 38 years ago and saw the change from solvent machines to water based to the convenience of thermal laminating and have witnessed the surges in UV varnishes over the last 2-3 decades. I'm in the business of adding value to print no matter what it is. Made so much out of laminating versus other coatings I'll admit a prejudice in that direction. Have run 60" wide ,70 foot long UV lines that cost $400,000 that pushed out $3000 per day, along side $5000 laminators that churned out $3400 per day.

Leaving out the maintenance costs out over three years say, let's concentrate on output versus market value for an "added value" process. Then:

Laminator UV Coater
Finance cost per month (A) $460 $920
Run quantity per month 30000 pcs 30000 pcs
Speed 1310 per hour 4565 per hour
Hour per month use 22.9 6.6
Labour cost @ $15/hour (B) $343 $99
Material Cost (C) $1800 $600

COST (A) + (B) + (C) $2603 $1619

Sales value $5000 $3000

Margin $2397 $1381

Now before we all leap up and down about the difference in sales values , I have taken what is normally perceived by customers when they look at laminated product up against a coating. Doesn't matter you say -- then you are not in this market of added value. We are talking 16 cents for laminating 1.2mil of film on something as opposed to approx 0.4mil of varnish at 10 cents per item. How much would you charge for say 1000 pcs off an IGEN,INDIGO,etc etc. Hopefully you don't rely on a difference of 6 cents or $60 on the job to make or break the contract?
On the other hand lets lower the laminating selling price to 13 cents and you end up with the same margin.

So, back to you to give me a quantity to work on and I can give you another scenario. Talk about 15000 per day as run by some contractors then the UV obviously has a big market.
UV does have its place in the litho area on mass magazine work, but we do see more "coffee table" expensive mags being laminated these days. Plus other added value on a laminator is that you can go from 1.2mil films right up to 10mil for whatever reason. You can get films that are embossed, holographic, metalised , anti-skid, etc that will all go thru the same device. UV varnish remains static in its variation.

 

[Bondmaster]

To read my calculations you will need to spread figures out. Altho I typed the reply with specific columns, the downlaod has justified everting ax to the left.

 

[Internal_R&D_Analyst]

So if I divide out the two cost by the 30,000 sheets I get 8.6 cents and 5.4 cents so a difference of 3.2 cents.

The cost difference per month in the machine is $460 so about 14,000 sheets a month would be the break even using your numbers.

 

[Bondmaster]

Ummm, not that it should sound like it does, but your calculation doesn't take into
account fixed and variable calcs that arrive at a different answer. But even taking
14000 as the figure the question of spending $30,000 to $50,000 on a UV device versus a
$12000 to $15,000 on a laminator has to be assessed in terms of useage. 14000 sheets is
only 6 hours so monthly figures are really in need of studying for the comparison to be
clear to a purchaser of equipment. I must admit I fired away without looking up specs on
the new coaters on the web. I am used to small laminators for laser/digital output and
high speed laminators & UV lines for offset quantities. Web figure show the UV lines at
2500 per hour when comparing to a laminator of 1310 to 1800 per hour . This changes the
final costs to approx 7.6 cents for laminating and 6 cents for UV. Other factors I've
left out are things like set up and wash down on UV versus a quick swipe for luck and
turn the switch off on the laminator, cost of UV fluid sold as a "commodity" to the large
high speed lines as opposed to UV fluids sold as part of a "solution", footprint size
value of floor rent for smaller operators ( we have a laminator that's 25" x 40"),60 amp
power requirement versus 20amp, and so on.
If the UV line is only wanted for scuff resistance on all output , then my argument
collapses. I speak from experience in Australasia that has print houses using laminators
for added value with superior offerings. When Audi of Ford push a new model ( not a good
analogy these days is it) they go with laminating on their brochures. When Circe du Solee
toured here the collectors program was UV'd and was rejected for smell (could be
overcome) and greasey fingerprinting to the tune of thousands of dollars and reproduced
again using a laminate.
UV on offset lines were introduced many years ago before the laser/digital era. We were
told it was the doom of laminating. To counter this we geared up with $400000 Steinemanns
etc. Figures show tho that lamination increased 20% per year since and now mature
consumers expect UV on mass produced magazines as opposed to wow betide the coffee table
mag that cost $10 that is not laminated.
We will be bringing out a small UV line as well for the short run arena as to go with the
flow. But it will be a while before coatings will gain the perception of added value that
lamination has. I'm near retirement and would be silly enough to talk a customer away
from my own UV line at high bucks and high profit in leiu of maintaining high end
products.

 

[Internal_R&D_Analyst]

Hey PP Members: How do you see UV coating and laminating? Is it values add or is it a purely visual thing, or a durability/scuff resistance issue such as for things being mailed.

In my opinion having USA locations with both lamination and UV coating, the purpose seams to fall more in with a scuff resistance factor and somewhat of a visual look then a true value add. We have installed more UV coaters then laminators in the past few years as customers ask for how can they protect the product at a lower cost per piece or provide a similar gloss look with less cost. I agree with the improvement to lamination you mention. We did replace 3 older laminators with 2 newer ones for a specific niche application that requires it. Maybe we should be looking at it lamination as a higher margin application.

What do others think in the USA and in other countries??