Why are CTP plates still more expensive?

[30YearsandCounting]

4-5 years ago we installed a thermal CTP machine. At the time, CTP plates were much more expensive than what we had been paying for conventional analog plates. The argument was that it was supply and demand, less manufacturing capacity etc. In other words, it was less competitive and they could get better margins on this new type of plate.

Since then, all plate manufacturing is primarily CTP and very, very little of the old analog plates. Our CTP plates pricing has come down, but it is still more expensive than what I can buy analog plates for in the same size, from the same manufacturer. Both types of plates use the same aluminum metal. The difference is only in the coating. I know that the cost of everything else has gone up, but should there still be a significant difference in the price between the two types of plates?

 

[bluekivi]

Re: Why are CTP plates still more expensive?

Compensating for the loss of sales. Flim AND plates=plates only. I would imagine that product development and research would play into it as well. It is still an evolving technology.

My guesses anyway.

 

[Prepper]

Re: Why are CTP plates still more expensive?

I think the same thing, always will be higher due to loss in film sales?

Anyway, we're still analog and wondering how long those prices will remain lower than CTP and how long they will continue to be available?

Terry

 

[Rolf]

Re: Why are CTP plates still more expensive?

We just switched to CTP four weeks ago, one reason was cost. We pay less for the same size plate (different vendor). I think prices of equipment and plates will go down as the market gets more saturated and the price of analog plates will eventually rise.

 

[moni47]

Re: Why are CTP plates still more expensive?

Hi

Me and my family operate a print house in Turkey, Istanbul.

We outsource prepress operations but they are a big issue for us. Both cost wise and time wise. CTP plates are expensive and prepress houses never deliver on time.
We have decided to invest in a CTP machine but we realized that basys CTcP machines operate with *conventional plates* and *without films* which are obviously *cheaper* (cost of thermal plate to conventnl plate is 2:1) and *easier to acquire* (at the moment)

We have some concerns *whether Basys CTcP is a wise choice or not.* I would highly appreciate if you can let me know your opinions:

1 - How soon will conventional plates be more expensive than thermal plates ? (or unavailable?)

2 - In my research on the web, I got the impression that *CTcP is more suitable for lower quality print ?* (newspapers, phonebooks etc.)
Distributor of basys in Turkey does not share this idea.
Is this true? why?

3 - How about operating costs of CTP vs CTcP machines - are they comparable except from plate costs?

I would really appreciate your input in anyways. Since there is not one single CTcP user in Istanbul, we could not get any feedback so far.

thanks a lot,

Regards,
Moni Zavaro
e-mail: [email protected]
mob: 90 533 263 99 66

Edited by: Moni Zavaro on Nov 22, 2007 7:13 AM

 

[qualityfocus]

Re: Why are CTP plates still more expensive?

hi Moni,

If you are looking for a low cost CTP machine, EPSON Printer based inkjet CTP systems are the lowest cost system that do the job.
If you need more information, please send me an e-mail. ([email protected])

Regards,

Louise Lu

 

[Bojan_Libra]

Analog plates

Analog plates

Wrong decision of tree big plate manufacture is to ignor Luscher and Basys is come to little plate manufacture start to sell more analog plates for printing shops that have Lusher or Basys. Now Kodak have all new plate for the same price for Basys and Lucher, also Fuji prepare new plate, that meens that produce of analog plates will rise and price will not growup, I have termal and uv tehnology, i berly use termal, all my jobs go to Basys, qualty is the same like termal (or beeter to say human eay cant see the difrence).

 

[SteveAgfa]

Greetings Bojan:

As one of the "Big 3", you are [incorrectly] suggesting that Agfa is ignoring Lüscher.
Please note the following joint press release of Lüscher and Agfa from April of this year.

AGFA.com - Lüscher AG and Agfa Graphics N.V. announce Joint Marketing Agreement for New :Aluva plates

<snip>

Lüscher AG and Agfa Graphics N.V. announce Joint Marketing Agreement for New :Aluva plates

Lüscher AG has announced today that it has accredited Agfa Graphics’ new plates range :Aluva to work on their line of UV platesetters. Both companies have entered the agreement to jointly market Agfa Graphics’ Aluva for Lüshers XPose! UV.

Press release Gretzenbach, Switzerland. Mortsel, Belgium April 20, 2009 09:00
<snip>

Regards,

 

[MichaelM]

CtP plates will stay more expensive

CtP plates will stay more expensive

The original question was: Why are thermal/violet plates more expensive than conventional ones?
Answer: Because it costs more to manufacture them!
For example, what most people do not know, that thermal plates, after coating, need to be stored 4-6 weeks in a warehouse under controlled conditions, regarding temperature and humidity.
Also, thermal/violet plates have higher costs in quality inspection, storing, cutting and transport; that all adds up to higher plate pricing.

As an industry consultant, I´ve watched plate prices for nearly 20 years. For the past 5 years, the price difference between conventional und thermal/violet plates has not changed. I bet that this will continue for years.

So all answers are a strong argument to take into respect CtP devices from BasysPrint, Cron (China) and Lüscher, using conventional plates.

 

[30YearsandCounting]

The original question was: Why are thermal/violet plates more expensive than conventional ones?
Answer: Because it costs more to manufacture them!
For example, what most people do not know, that thermal plates, after coating, need to be stored 4-6 weeks in a warehouse under controlled conditions, regarding temperature and humidity.
Also, thermal/violet plates have higher costs in quality inspection, storing, cutting and transport; that all adds up to higher plate pricing.

As an industry consultant, I´ve watched plate prices for nearly 20 years. For the past 5 years, the price difference between conventional und thermal/violet plates has not changed. I bet that this will continue for years.

So all answers are a strong argument to take into respect CtP devices from BasysPrint, Cron (China) and Lüscher, using conventional plates.

I asked this question back in 2007 and here is an update:
Two years later I am now able to get thermal CTP plates from 2 of the big 3 manufacturers for not much more than what I paid for analog plates 4-5 years ago. It's a more mature product now. The recession that we are in has caused (almost) everybody to be much more aggressive (than I thought was possible). My pricing has come down 20-30% from what it was. I'm still using roughly the same number of plates etc. so it would appear that things have changed. I don't think that anybody wants to lose business these days, so it pays to be an aggressive negotiator.

 

[Ian Mackenzie]

I will be very curious to see if there really are some viable Chinese CTP plates at Print '09.
Rumor has it that there will be a few of them.
some may be suspect, others may be worth looking at.

If they (the Chinese) bring their pricing and products to the NA market, then I will be very curious to see how Kodak, Agfa and Fuji fair. As well as the average graphic arts dealer......

New Report Looks at Chinese CTP Suppliers - Printing Industry News from WhatTheyThink

 

[Hector Howson]

Don't compare a plate with something like a kettle or clothing where the labour element is very high giving plenty of room for savings. The biggest costs with plates is the aluminium itself plus distribution which leaves little room to reduce prices unless there is little or no R&D expense or technical support so you will get what you pay for.

In real terms the cost of a CTP plate is much lower than it was 10 or 15 years ago and the cost of getting a plate on press even more markedly lower. CTP is now fairly mature so we will see copycat products just like we did in the seventies when presensitised plates became mature but are any of those cheap vendors big names now? Well no, what we have is the big three who plough a lot of money into product development that has given us greener, tougher and more technologically adanced products for today's conditions.

 

[KMGI Sales]

I will be very curious to see if there really are some viable Chinese CTP plates at Print '09.
Rumor has it that there will be a few of them.
some may be suspect, others may be worth looking at.

If they (the Chinese) bring their pricing and products to the NA market, then I will be very curious to see how Kodak, Agfa and Fuji fair. As well as the average graphic arts dealer......

New Report Looks at Chinese CTP Suppliers - Printing Industry News from WhatTheyThink

Now why is it people always seem to forget there is a Big 4 not three. I don't mean to thrust Konica into the limelight, well yes I do, but Konica Minolta Graphic Imaging has a large variety of Both Thermal and Violet plates on the market today. So lets not forget about little ole us, doing so only proves to be the downfall of the "big three"

 

[SteveAgfa]

Hi KMGI...

As a point of interest,

Based on recent NPES and Schreiber vendor-supplied data,
for digital metal plates in the US market, other than the "big 3",
the "others" all together represented about 13% market share.

Regards,

 

[KMGI Sales]

Hi KMGI...

As a point of interest,

Based on recent NPES and Schreiber vendor-supplied data,
for digital metal plates in the US market, other than the "big 3",
the "others" all together represented about 13% market share.

Regards,

Steve, well quite interesting, I am betting within the past few months thats shifting quite a bit...lol...I know I am enjoying taking your accounts away..

 

[SteveAgfa]

Hi KMGI:

I can't discuss material information in a public forum,
but I can point to our recent Q2 results. One can then
compare this, to that of others, and draw their own
conclusions on market share shifts.

Regards,

 

[KMGI Sales]

Steve, no worries, we all tend to shift from account to account at times, and I did not mean Afga in general, although we have switched accounts a few times over the year as well...it happens, although I am gaining ground on the "other two"... but it helps to have my technical background and then move into sales. 11 years with Konica as a tech and now in sales does prove to be beneficial. Customers tend to like that I have the expertise that I do..but then again I have seen your posts as well, and you too seem quite technical.