Ah, budgets

[mojoprime]

So, i'm hoping some of you veterans of the print world can help me. it's budget time again, and once again they'e looking to trim the fat. one of the things that looks fatty is our v80 (which needs to be upgraded to a 180 but that's another discussion). they want to know if a cheaper model will work. i've got a variety of empirical evidence that says cheaper is not the way to go, but i'd be much obliged if some of you can offer your insights. they would go with a c50/60 and i'm aware of the differences in speed, paper weight handling, registration, duplexing of heavier stocks, running high GSM out of every tray...can you help me with what i'm missing?

my eternal thanks!

 

[PricelineNegotiator]

We used to run a 7775, which is like 3 gens behind the c60 before we got our J75, which are only one generation apart. That being said, I think it would be a horrible move to move to the c50/c60 as I don't think it can auto-duplex above 212 gsm. Everything will most certainly run MUCH slower, registration is not great, and your RIP capabilities are much worse.

 

[AP90]

So, i'm hoping some of you veterans of the print world can help me. it's budget time again, and once again they'e looking to trim the fat. one of the things that looks fatty is our v80 (which needs to be upgraded to a 180 but that's another discussion). they want to know if a cheaper model will work. i've got a variety of empirical evidence that says cheaper is not the way to go, but i'd be much obliged if some of you can offer your insights. they would go with a c50/60 and i'm aware of the differences in speed, paper weight handling, registration, duplexing of heavier stocks, running high GSM out of every tray...can you help me with what i'm missing?

my eternal thanks!

I think you'd most likely be taking a fairly large step back in quality between the 2 machines. From what I understand the V80 produces some pretty good prints, and I believe the C60/70 uses the old fuser technology which does not do as good as the new belt fusers.

 

[mojoprime]

that's what i was thinking too. i'm not sure they'll do it, but they're going to ask and our IT people tend to look at dollars and not capabilities because ultimately, they think we just make pretty things on the machines. but, yeah, you're right about the auto duplex -- that's a huge thing for us. we run a lot of 280-350 gsm and the c50/60 can't do that heavy or on auto. life would be infinitely worse having to manually duplex loooong runs. thanks, guys. i appreciate the help.

 

[namelessentity]

Maybe you should suggest that your IT department replace all their computers with cheaper slower models to save money as well.

 

[mojoprime]

ha. yeah, we've thought of doing that as well and then we remember that they equipped a lot of folks with first gen surface books so essentially that covers it.

 

[MailGuru]

What's a "budget"?

 

[mojoprime]

it's that word that never comes up until you have to make cutbacks.

 

[MailGuru]

What's a "budget"?

I was half kidding, but, IMHO, budgets aren't really much use in this line of work. Let's say I just landed a 400,000 pc digital print job, and, I need to buy 2 pallets of toner to produce it, only we've already exceeded our toner budget for the year............. do I turn it down?

 

[mojoprime]

that's kind of the issue we're in to right now: if they walk by, and the machine isn't being used, then we're wasting money on the expensive machine. and then they walk away and i have run 20,000 through it.

 

[bill kahny]

Printing is getting so easy push button walk away even a monkey can do it! ... my life

 

[MailGuru]

Bean-Counters will never understand this kind of business. For most, it's "feast or famine".

Our machines might sit idle for a day or two, then we're slammed and figuring out how to stagger shifts to keep them running 24/7 to meet the delivery date. If they back away, and look at the big picture (the P&L), they will see how profitable those machines really are. We're lucky in that we do have a few regular daily & weekly jobs for ongoing projects, so, you will seldom ever see a machine at idle, but, it does happen from time to time. However, I do understand the frustration. Last year the CFO cut us from 3 machines down to 2 machines because anytime he walked through, he seldom saw all three running at the same time. We had to compensate by staggering the operator shifts to get more print hours per day.

 

[MailGuru]

Printing is getting so easy push button walk away even a monkey can do it! ... my life

Yep, just press the button

 

[mojoprime]

yeah, i know it's hard to understand, if you're a bean counter, why everything we do is so expensive, why everything takes a little time and why you can't just push a button and make things happen.

 

[arossetti]

Last year the CFO cut us from 3 machines down to 2 machines because anytime he walked through, he seldom saw all three running at the same time. We had to compensate by staggering the operator shifts to get more print hours per day.

When he looks at the numbers at the end of the year he will say: Wow we really did only need two printers. Wonder if we can get by with one printer.

 

[MailGuru]

When he looks at the numbers at the end of the year he will say: Wow we really did only need two printers. Wonder if we can get by with one printer.

LOL - Already has............. I put my foot down, though. I convinced him that with only 1 machine, we have no redundancy backup for when it goes down. I told him that the quickest way to go bankrupt in this business is to not be able to deliver what you promised on time. The client doesn't care if you had machine issues. That's not their problem!

 

[mojoprime]

LOL - Already has............. I put my foot down, though. I convinced him that with only 1 machine, we have no redundancy backup for when it goes down. I told him that the quickest way to go bankrupt in this business is to not be able to deliver what you promised on time. The client doesn't care if you had machine issues. That's not their problem!

agreed! it only takes the one unfulfilled request from the CEO for marketing materials to make removing or downgrading the machine a huge mistake...

 

[davarino]

I come from a different mindset entirely. (It might be part of the reason we are growing at least 5% a year )

Never take a machine from the floor unless it is counterproductive. Fill every machine and buy more machinery (used if possible) to make up the increased volume.

The CFO's "trim it back" mindset in a contracting industrial sector will lead to lack of capacity and of flexibility, which will make everybody sure that they are being as efficient as possible... and they will be ready to die.

Always work on filling capacity, not on reducing the capacity to be filled. Reducing capacity simply means that you don't see any reason to get more of the market.