C900 Vs. Xerox 700 vs. HP1050

[GregNac19]

Just a side note. I run 300gsm duplexing on our Xerox 700 all the time. The only thing that will be slightly different is the ink coverage, which is very minimal (I can't notice a difference). All you have to do is load the 300gsm into one of the duplexing trays and tell the machine it's 177-220gsm. It's no big deal. Yes, it runs slower but...faster than manually duplexing it at 300gsm (depending on run size). Hope this helps.

This is one of those things it "can do" but a good salesman should say "not supposed to do".
The reason is the service techs will not be happy if you are auto duplexing 300gsm. They should say it is out of specs. Just a word of warning.

 

[msaeger]

Yeah even when the sales people say it's not supposed to do it but it works ok in the demo it is still trouble later when it doesn't work at the customers. The problem is they buy based on it working at the demo for short time then when they really run it they have problems. Then I get to go tell them it's out of the spec. Being a tech I just tell customers it's out of the specs and leave it at that.

If I was the one buying I would get all my info from the manufactures websites. Then demo the machines that are spec'd to do what I want.

(i'm not talking specifically about the c900 or any machine just the sales process in general)

 

[Selling Prints]

Ricoh C900

Ricoh C900

I am curious as to how well the ricoh product is doing in the marketplace. Is this unit capable of doing 100k or more month in month out? Specs say 400,000 but I am wondering what the real world volumes are for this product. It seems farily inexpensive for the speed and image quality it brings.

 

[[email protected]]

C900

C900

I am curious as to how well the ricoh product is doing in the marketplace. Is this unit capable of doing 100k or more month in month out? Specs say 400,000 but I am wondering what the real world volumes are for this product. It seems farily inexpensive for the speed and image quality it brings.

Well first of all I am a Ricoh PPBG employee so my view is self-serving. That said I'll try to be as objective as I can. The C900 is doing very well in the marketplace. There is a good mix of placements at commercial printers, in-house print shops, fulfillment centers etc. It is very capable of doing over 100k/month, every month, however 400K would be appropriate for a peak month. Personally I've supported installs for volumes ranging from 40K to 150+K/month. The consistancy of quality holds up very well over long runs, and the darn thing hardly ever jams. You're right it is inexpensive however it's not just a tricked-out MFP but a clean sheet design with engineering from both Hitachi and Ricoh.

 

[arossetti]

Even the 8000AP is not rated for 300gsm duplex, but it does it fine - 14pt C2S is when it stops working for me.

 

[msaeger]

I am just a Ricoh tech so what do I know. I can't see 100k a month being a problem. When they say 400k a month that is 400k A4/LT LEF sheets. If you run everything 2 up on 12x18 you still only get charged one click for the 12x18 (or whatever size) but the pm counter which I use to determine when to replace the maintenance items would count it as 2.

The only problems I have had have been incorrect media type choices. I think the price is low because Ricoh is trying to break into the market not because the machine is cheap. If you are really interested go waste some sales persons time and do a demo it won't cost you anything.

 

[Jtamoe46]

My suggestion is the 5000AP, 7000AP, 8000AP.

 

[Craig]

Even the 8000AP is not rated for 300gsm duplex, but it does it fine - 14pt C2S is when it stops working for me.

Yes it is rated for duplex up to and including 300gsm, it will be in the CED. The software has not caught up to it though, you will have to lie to the machine based on the directions in the CED.

 

[gcspec]

Xerox iGen is the answer here. The Indigo is old and out of date. The larger sheet size along with unbelievable throughput makes this worth your while for sure! Talk to your rep about a "previously enjoyed" iGen 3. They go back through the line and are completely refreshed including a brand-new controller

 

[gcspec]

I am a Xerox salesperson and I'm very careful to share what we say our machines can do and will do so there is no trouble down the road. Duplexing 300 GSM is out of spec - do customers do it? Do they have success doing it? Do our service techs support this? These are the questions indeed. I will not answer them in a public forum other to say - "300 gsm is out of spec for this machine".

 

[Craig]

I am a Xerox salesperson and I'm very careful to share what we say our machines can do and will do so there is no trouble down the road. Duplexing 300 GSM is out of spec - do customers do it? Do they have success doing it? Do our service techs support this? These are the questions indeed. I will not answer them in a public forum other to say - "300 gsm is out of spec for this machine".

WRONG!!!!!!! Get a CED and read the following:

"The DocuColor 8000AP Digital Press can automatically produce duplex prints from all paper trays for coated and uncoated media weights up to 300 g/m2. Paper sizes supported are 11 x 17/A3 and 12 x 18/SRA3. At this time, 8.5 x 11/A4 substrates continue to have a maximum duplex weight of up to 220 g/m2.

• The system software has not been updated to include this new functionality. It will be required to set the paper tray weight to 186-220 gsm. This setting, in conjunction with the new Custom Paper Profile and appropriate Decurler settings, will help achieve the best performance and image quality."

Page 11 8000AP - CED version 4, it really is a fun read.... you should try it some day!

 

[gcspec]

Not Wrong!

Not Wrong!

I was talking about the 700DCP which is rated to duplex only up to 220 gsm (80# coated cover) according to the CED. You are correct about the DC8000AP though. Trust me, I am painfully aware of just how fun our CED's are to read as I am required to go over them with my customers and get their signature on every piece of production equipment I sell. Some of my competitors should try recommending the proper piece of equipment to their customers some time - it would cause them far less trouble 2 months later when the machine can't really do any of the things the sales guy said it would. I'd rather lose a sale on the wrong piece of equipment, than go down the sleazy path and promise a customer the stars then deliver a pile of you know what. Seen it too many times. Keep rockin' Craig!

 

[gcspec]

Clarification - this comment was made in reply to someone asking about the 700dcp which does not "support" auto-duplex of 300gsm stock - not the dc8000ap. Just want to be totally clear about that!!!

 

[overtwo]

This is one of those things it "can do" but a good salesman should say "not supposed to do".
The reason is the service techs will not be happy if you are auto duplexing 300gsm. They should say it is out of specs. Just a word of warning.

It's funny because our service tech has told me the machine will perform fine duplexing 300gsm, the only area it will lack is in ink coverage. He seems like a very competent tech (after dealing with many others at previous shops) so I'll take his word for it.

 

[GregNac19]

It's funny because our service tech has told me the machine will perform fine duplexing 300gsm, the only area it will lack is in ink coverage. He seems like a very competent tech (after dealing with many others at previous shops) so I'll take his word for it.

If your technician says that is it OK, go for it! They are the ones nobody wants to piss off.