Help!! Which one to go with!

[atprinter]

Can anyone tell me about canon imageRUNNER ADVANCE 7055?

we have a Xerox 250, we are getting a extra machine in, has option of X700, konica 5501, or canon 7055.
So far, I like the Konica, but 600dpi is a problem when doing small txt or reverse white text and object on image.
Xerox is the best but price is double of canon or konica, and print look slightly more digital than offset.

When I spoke to Canon sale on phone, they talking about c9075 pro, I seem the printed samples, fall between konica and Xerox, I am quick happy, but then I received a quote is 7055, sure the price is cheaper, but are they much difference between c9065pro vs 7055? Quality? How long is c7055 been on the market?

I am doing light volume for now but expect to increase gradually, I want something more reliable, especially come to heavy stock, registration etc.

I'm hoping to get some feedback from people out here. help me make the decision as soon as possible.

Thanks

 

[gordo]

So far, I like the Konica, but 600dpi is a problem when doing small txt or reverse white text and object on image.

Dpi is not a neasure of resolution. It is a measure of addressability. The best way to determine if the printer can render the text size that you're concerned about is to test it.

Best, gordo

 

[atprinter]

Thanks gordo

Yes, I agree DPI is not a measure of resolution...

I have already test the machines, Xerox 700, Konica 5501 and c6000, canon 9065 pro and Ricoh with the same files, print on same weight of paper etc.

Only the text/object on image suffer from the jitter edge from 5501, have spoke to the Konica about this, and they suggest the C6000 will not have such issue. (I know cos I have the same test samples from c6000).

I have all these prints compared side by side and DPI does make difference some time.

But the solid color and offset feel produce by Konica is the best among all these machines I tested.

Thanks

Dpi is not a neasure of resolution. It is a measure of addressability. The best way to determine if the printer can render the text size that you're concerned about is to test it.

Best, gordo

 

[michaelejahn]

look at MTBF as well

look at MTBF as well

The only thing other than quality / price you might want to ask about is MTBF

Mean time between failures - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[GuruMorgor]

We have a 7055 at our little shop. Its been good for what we do with it, small runs <1000 of postcards, business cards, flyers and such. Color is kinda lame in comparison to KM, we have a little bizhub c203 up front for the office and I've seen it do better color. We're about 3 years deep on a 5 year lease and its never been what I'd call out of service. Tech usually would show up an hour or 3 after placing the call and iron out any issues which were usually minor. If I had to gripe about anything it would be the registration when printing 2 sides is not that great. We use mostly #80 cover, coated and uncoated, but have run up to #120. Command Workstation software is easy to use and works well with mac or pc. Feel free to ask me anything about it.

 

[atprinter]

Thanks .
MTBF is hard to predict I guess, I am on light volume usage, so shouldn't be a major issue at least for now. From time to time all machines needs service, fast tech service is really concern I guess.

The only thing other than quality / price you might want to ask about is MTBF

Mean time between failures - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[atprinter]

Thanks !!

I just spoke to Canon sales and they said 7055 is exactly "light" version of 9065 pro, suit for light production(low volume), but somehow I am not convince...

So, the machine is solid and reliable? How is printing small text? Dose it have issue on the jitter edge when printing white text/object on image?

Thanks for your help.

We have a 7055 at our little shop. Its been good for what we do with it, small runs <1000 of postcards, business cards, flyers and such. Color is kinda lame in comparison to KM, we have a little bizhub c203 up front for the office and I've seen it do better color. We're about 3 years deep on a 5 year lease and its never been what I'd call out of service. Tech usually would show up an hour or 3 after placing the call and iron out any issues which were usually minor. If I had to gripe about anything it would be the registration when printing 2 sides is not that great. We use mostly #80 cover, coated and uncoated, but have run up to #120. Command Workstation software is easy to use and works well with mac or pc. Feel free to ask me anything about it.

 

[GuruMorgor]

I just printed some 4pt type out in black and reversed in white and it was quite legible (with a magnifying glass). I've seen some jitters, cracking, washing out, mis-registration of color, spots, runs, streaks and all sorts of things happen. The techs are all about the climate the machine is in and how your paper is stored. I've run paper that just came off the truck thru it with some poor results, so its tempermental at times. I have to admit that I don't envy your position in making this decision, the canon sales team had a hot blond that made my boss all jittery, thats why we have the machine.

 

[atprinter]

Thanks GuruMorgor, your input helps me!!

I told Canon to get me an used 9075pro rather than new 7055, I can see Canon machines having difficulty of printing textured/linen paper compare to others, so will see.

I just got back second time from Konica demo on 5501, they seem to improve a lot of jitter edge issues after few setting adjusted, impressive! Although Xerox still seem print a bit better but value for money, Konica is the one!

I just printed some 4pt type out in black and reversed in white and it was quite legible (with a magnifying glass). I've seen some jitters, cracking, washing out, mis-registration of color, spots, runs, streaks and all sorts of things happen. The techs are all about the climate the machine is in and how your paper is stored. I've run paper that just came off the truck thru it with some poor results, so its tempermental at times. I have to admit that I don't envy your position in making this decision, the canon sales team had a hot blond that made my boss all jittery, thats why we have the machine.

 

[Craig]

If you plan on doing any off line finishing you might want to look at this. Take 250 to 500 print samples with moderate to heavy toner 4/4 coverage and jog them, run them through your folder, cut them. You may be surprised at what you find. In our experience the prints from a Konica were very slippery, very hard to handle and did not register well in our Baum 2020 folder (which is fairly new and in immaculate condition). We did this with prints from Xerox and Konica (which were he only machines we were looking at). When doing a demo I wouldn't consider it "real" without printing at least 1000 sheets of various stocks. You may find the value for the money gets lost in the finishing because of added labor.

 

[Josh]

If you plan on doing any off line finishing you might want to look at this. Take 250 to 500 print samples with moderate to heavy toner 4/4 coverage and jog them, run them through your folder, cut them. You may be surprised at what you find. In our experience the prints from a Konica were very slippery, very hard to handle and did not register well in our Baum 2020 folder (which is fairly new and in immaculate condition). We did this with prints from Xerox and Konica (which were he only machines we were looking at). When doing a demo I wouldn't consider it "real" without printing at least 1000 sheets of various stocks. You may find the value for the money gets lost in the finishing because of added labor.

Hi Craig,

That's an interesting point... was that between the Xerox 8080 and Konica 8000?

How does the output compare on the 8080 compared to the Xerox 8000? Are there big differences to mechanics of the fuser?

 

[atprinter]

Craig, You are very much right. Demo machines, aren't they always looks great! I don't think they will let me run 250 to 500 print samples, unless I go for the new machine, you know. Based on your experience, does Xerox(or was that between 700 and 5501 machine) handle(color, registration) better than Konica?

Anyone have experience on c9075pro, I just been told the price is similar to X700, does it worth to try(demo)? I'm just tired go through demo again, because all these machines print out are much similar, all I need the machine is reliable, consistent and predictable - no surprise.

Thanks all.

If you plan on doing any off line finishing you might want to look at this. Take 250 to 500 print samples with moderate to heavy toner 4/4 coverage and jog them, run them through your folder, cut them. You may be surprised at what you find. In our experience the prints from a Konica were very slippery, very hard to handle and did not register well in our Baum 2020 folder (which is fairly new and in immaculate condition). We did this with prints from Xerox and Konica (which were he only machines we were looking at). When doing a demo I wouldn't consider it "real" without printing at least 1000 sheets of various stocks. You may find the value for the money gets lost in the finishing because of added labor.

 

[Craig]

Josh, yes it was between the 8080 and 8000 as well as KM7000 (thought about getting 2 of them). The differences in the fusers are... well different all together. But here is a fact. The 8080 in All weights mode does not slow down, no matter what the paper weight is. The 8000 slows down over 300gsm to a crawl (I think it's 300gsm, if I'm wrong I'll stand corrected). So if your like me and run a lot of cover weights then you will see the difference. That's why I was looking at 2 KM7000 because they would outpace the single 8000 on cover weight stock. The print quality on the KM machines are fine from my tests. Each machine class has good and bad points, you need to make a list of them and see which one fits your situation better.

atprinter - I'm sorry I really don't have experience on those machines. You tell the sales monkey you WILL be running as many sheets as you think are required for a good demo, or the deal is off the table. Believe me these guys are hurting for a sale and will do what you want.

 

[atprinter]

Thanks Craig, I will do more demo before decide!!
I asked KM for information on 6501 cos I think 5501 is slow when printing heavy stocks, will see what they come back (that was 3 days ago, no reply... hmm...).

Xerox just asked me to wait a week or two, they said they can do a "significant" deal, sounds interesting!

atprinter - I'm sorry I really don't have experience on those machines. You tell the sales monkey you WILL be running as many sheets as you think are required for a good demo, or the deal is off the table. Believe me these guys are hurting for a sale and will do what you want.

 

[lfelton]

... The 8000 slows down over 300gsm to a crawl (I think it's 300gsm, if I'm wrong I'll stand corrected)...

As far as I've been told the actual figures are (all SRA3, other sizes will vary):

46ppm SRA3 up to 135gsm
40ppm SRA3 up to 300gsm
23ppm SRA3 up to 350gsm

So there is a big speed decrease ABOVE 300gsm, but not at 300gsm. We have no complaints over the speed of the c8000, but then again we are not running heavyweight stock through it all day, our work tends to be very mixed.

Of course you need to understand the other limitations (that KM won't be so keen to let you know):

(1) No duplexing above 300gsm
(2) No use of the HD stacker (with dolly) on heavyweight stock. From memory that means approximately 250gsm and above and this is a real pain in the backside. Especially so if you are predominantly running heavy stock.

So, some good news (not as slow as Craig feared, actually pretty darn good), BUT some other bad news if you are running a lot of heavy stock.

Hope that helps.

 

[atprinter]

Ok... I got Konica back to me regarding the C6501 price, apparently the machine has done very little only 300k, so will be more money than 5501.

Xerox also came back to me with a new X700 deal, they are trying to match the C5501 price!! X700 was double the price of C5501, now they try to match the price... interesting! The sale coming tomorrow will see what happen...

So... If X700 and C5501/6501 are same price and similar configurations, which one do you pick?

Thanks

 

[Craig]

x700 hands down! Keep in mind that the mid level production machines are not selling lot hotcakes right now, so sales monkeys are going to be a little more aggressive.

Good Luck!!

 

[atprinter]

Thanks Craig.

I just got Xerox sale sent me the new deal... disappointed, I think I was totally misunderstanding!! Still double the price of a 5501. I can get 2x C5501 = 110pages per min =), still have few thousands extra for a new 3D 55 inch TV!!

I was almost decided go to X if the price match, well I am wrong again. They said X machines are always cost top $$, guess it is right and must stop dreaming now... business is business

Thanks.

 

[Craig]

Definitely an apples to crab apples kinda comparison though. The 5501 is an office copier (fast plastic) and the 700 is an entry level production box. The 5501 will not perform in a production environment for the length of the lease in my opinion.

I hope you have good lock with it!!

 

[chrisg42]

The 5501 is a 6501 with reduced speed and limited options. We successfully used a 6500 for light production for 5 years, until we upgraded to an 8000. Whilst the 5501 is not from the latest generation (effectively replaced by 6000L), it could be a good buy if the fit is right.

If you are set on having a 700, tell Xerox you are pretty well decided on the 5501. I was offered a 770 last year at a fire-sale price in an attempt to lure me away from KM. With all suppliers of this type of kit, don't take "no" for an answer when it comes to price; keep pressing and you might be surprised.