my own business

Oh so that explains the "per click" metrics, more clicks equals more consumption. The light is slowly getting brighter:D. I went to American printers website and started some more data mining its helping me sort out the differences between inks, toners and oil and their applications. Thanks for your insight and quick response
 
Ive looked online for used printers, namely xerox machines and I am having a hard time finding any. Does anyone know where on the web to look for used machines like a 41xx series b/w or a dc 5000?
 
tried calling you

tried calling you

Hey Din,

thanks for leaving me your number, I tried calling you but the girl at your shop says that you leave really early. I dont get off of work til 330pm so I guess ill try you on my break.
 
ok, here is a list of reputable suppliers of xerox machines:

Barry Lynn X-Digital 800-318-7914
Jim Lambe OCM Technical 585-359-1123

i have bought dc6060's and dc12's and 7655's through both. very honest and good customer service!
 
As far as B/ W machines... as a posts said - Canon is not a strongest machine for deep solods because tHE Development system does not use actual developer - toner goes directly on to Magnetic roller and being introdused to the drum. It creates a lot less maintenance but Solid Solids are better with Developer based machines which is pretty much everybody else in the game.
 
I have DC3535 on Ebay :)
A nice WC7665 will run 5-6k
A DC-250 is about 2K more.
I don't have those in stock but given some reasonable time can hunt a nice machine - I mean Lease return / repo not from Ebay - that you can do on your own.
 
Ok,
the WC76xx series is looking good to start out with cost to purchase wise, I know I know its more expensive per click but thats what my budget is dictating right now. If business goes well Id like to get a xerox 4112 and a 5000ap in the future...both used of course. By the way I love this site, you are all very helpful and comical as well. What I mean is that some of you die hards really get going over which mfg is better and why, which leads the post going on a tangent way off course.

I would like to thank Dino for taking the time out the other day and showing me his print shop and info, very kind of you.
 
Hello all,

I am a commercial electrician who is curious about starting my own digital printing business (in my garage of 350 sq ft). I live in the silicon valley and have a few contacts at various companies who are fed up with fedexkinkos and would be interested in giving me some work if I were to start my own place. I stumbled on to this website while researching digital printers. Obviously I am not going to be doing anything as exotic as any of you who do this for living but the work needed to be done doesnt need to be. Mostly its legal, h.r. and marketing stuff that are in binders or folders.

Please no insults or negative comments, if you dont approve or have anything constructive to say please move on. To those of you who admire my bravery/foolishness and have some tribal knowledge please feel free to comment.

Heres what I would like to know right of the bat,

machines= new or used?
lease or purchase?
which brand? (xerox seems to be the 800lb gorilla)

I want machines that are the first entries in commercial printing (not high end office printers). Someone suggested three machines. One color(xerox 700), one b&w (xerox 4110), and one machine that makes spiral and comb style binders [is that what the plastic binders are called?]. These are just a few of my many questions, Im data mining right now and all the info I can gather will help me determine if this venture is worth doing. Im not in any hurry this is just something Im looking into and would like to do if feasible.

Thank you in advance:eek:

Don't ever consider Xerox, when you don't pay they sue you till your pants drop.
 
Don't ever consider Xerox, when you don't pay they sue you till your pants drop.

I would recommend Canon their color is very closed to offset and the service are fantastic.

So and check them out, seriously don't ever bother about xerox they are the worse crap company, when you buying they will treat you like Kings but once you paid you are going to pay through your nose bleed. Every services you required from them need to pay and pay.

Daniel Goh
 
Hey Daniel,

so which models would you recommend and which models are you using? What are you paying for them as far as monthly service plus click rate?

I heard that Ricoh or someone bought out Canon and the service is in a disarray have you noticed anything in regards to this?

I've been adivised by many that a used canon would be the way to go but the comments about canon's service is something to make me reconsider. Anyhow Im looking forward to your response and thanks again.

Fred
 
I heard that Ricoh or someone bought out Canon and the service is in a disarray have you noticed anything in regards to this?


Ricoh bought Ikon, Canon bought Oce. The service you get from any company is going to vary with where you are. The people working at the offices aren't robots :) Xerox might be crap where Daniel is but Canon could be bad were Fred is.

I think it would be helpful if people included where they are when talking about the service they receive.
 
Hi! Just like to add my 2 cents of experience. It might be a li'l irrelevant seeing as I'm in Australia but what you're looking to do seems similar to what I had to go through the last 10 years.

Quick background: My brother and I bought a small print shop off a printer. My background was in graphic arts with a bit of pre press knowledge and that helped a bit but we had no experience in the actual print industry & finishing side of things, etc, so we had to learn on the way.

We had such crappy gear at the start but they did the job! A vintage 1 colour offset, an old pc, an A4 to DL folder, platemaker, guillotine, drill press (some of which we still use actually). The equipment wasn't worth what we paid for the business tbh but the main thing was the previous owner had established a list of repeat clientele already.

We worked our butts off at the start (we still do, but now we only avg a 12 hr work day instead of 18 :p ) and it slowly started to pay off, gradually upgrading however we could with whatever we could afford.

Onto digital printing - our first machine was a Docucolor 1250, entry level I couldn't find any other machine that could do what it could do, heavy stocks, decent reproduction, colour, nice solids and clients loved the glossy wax finish. Next was a C450, more of a office environment machine but the click rate we were offered was good at the time. We also went through a number of b/w machines copiers.

Latest upgrade was the Docucolor 5065 when it came out - which I still use atm. I don't know how it compares to the 252 (they read similar) but from experience I LOVE this machine! It's an entry level machine, new we got it for ~$50k with stapler, hole puncher, booklet maker etc and an even better click rate than our 2 previous FX's. Most brands probably offer something on par with it these days, BUT.... one thing I'd like to STRONGLY point out is that it could reliably run offset gloss stock without any bubbling. Why's this important? You'll find paper made for digital printers are usually much more expensive than offset grade papers, especially when it comes to gloss stock and labels (here in Oz anyway); a few cents diff per sheet certainly adds up. Our supplier has a range of a quality (but inexpensive) offset gloss and matt stock that I use in 128, 150, 170, 200, 250, 300 and 350gsm (here it's called Sovereign Gloss / Matt Silk btw, and the gloss labels we use are Jac Brilliant Gloss 170gsm). Our clients have always been happy with them.

I can also run NCR paper through it to make short run invoice books if needed. Numbering is done through a $70 software i bought on the net or on a machine I bought 2nd hand that does perfing / scoring / numbering (GW 6000).

We're looking at the new Xerox Color 550/560 as an upgrade when they release it here next year, sounds like a nice machine (start price is <$35k for the 550 supposedly).

I guess this is where brand loyalty comes in, for me, I've tested and looked into other machines but I still lean towards Fuji Xerox machines, just for the fact that I comfortably know it can take what I give it where none of the other brands have managed to, plus tech support have been reliable and... 'unquestioning' when it comes to 'unusual cases' ;)

So as you can see everyone has different opinions and experiences with each brand / machine.

Imho digital printing has rapidly improved so much the last few years, so whatever you choose it should do the job well. But, on a side note, I'd like to say, regardless of what machine each person has vouched for here, from experience, I've found most trouble stems from the Sales Rep! (no offence to any out there, I know it's their job) :p Don't take their word for it, make sure what they promise is in writing, and triple check the contract, even then, you'll end up getting screwed by them! Just kidding! :p I hope you don't. ;)

And if you want to find out something, most of the time the best people to ask are the Tech guys, I find they're usually more up front with you. :)

Oh, and with the click rate... new or old machine, it's worth getting, saves a lotta hassle when it comes to consumables and tech support / service. Just make sure you get a click rate that's charged by pass regardless of paper size, eg print on A3 and you'll halve your cost per pass than if you were to print on 2 A4s. Mmmm! ...bad analogy since you use different paper sizes there :p

Anyway, it's a hard slog to start with and will be a steep learning curve if you're not originally from the industry but it can be quite lucrative if you find that niche and establish some repeat clients. We've been fortunate, we've never had to advertise, most of our new customers come from word of mouth. We do have a store front but we rarely have walk-ins.

We also have a network of trade printers we can outsource jobs we can't do inhouse so we've also become a print broker of sorts for our clients.

Sometimes we have to bend over backwards for our clients but in the end they appreciate this and come back regardless of whether we're the cheapest or not.

Lots more I'd like to mention but this is such a long post already, sorry! :p

Just thought I'd share and give some insight from someone who's experienced what you may be getting into. It's a risk, it is hard work and very stressful at times (see: deadlines) but it is feasible!

All the best if you decide to do it! :)
 
digital printers

digital printers

Not sure if anyone has mentioned the Konica Minolta bizhub 6500? I have been in digital printing for ten years and have worked with Xerox, Cannon (please avoid) and now KM. I think the KM is a great machine. I am going to start my own biz soon and it is what I am going to buy. It is a very robust machine. All metal drawers/guts no plastic. Registration is dead on, and color holds well with regular tune ups. One thing thing I had issues with were the coronas. They needed to be replaced or cleaned a lot but service with the company was excellent! And they would come right away and fix the issue. I haven't used a Xerox lately but I have read the KM is about the same is not better than the 700. Plus its a lot less $$ hope this helps and a little piece of advice. I would try to work in a print shop for a while. They can be pretty complex machines and it could get frustraiting just jumping into it. Good luck!! Also go with Creo for you print server and NOT EFI! Trust me on that one!
 

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