Paying for Machine that's out of service....

[kdw75]

Does anyone know if Xerox will reimburse you for the days that your machine is down due to service not being able to get it fixed for a week? I am not talking about lost productivity, but for the daily lease amount. Our machine has been down for 5 business days, and they have been here 3 times trying to fix it, and keep ordering parts. I can't find any mention in our contract.

 

[Guest]

If it's not covered in the contract, they won't do it. Xerox is worse than insurance companies when it comes to getting compensated for their failures, yet they never let you off the hook when the tables are turned. My suggestion would be to send them a formal written request for damages incurred, and then if they refuse (which they will), threaten to file in small claims court. They don't want to have to show up in court so they will likely to settle it.

You have to be strong with them or they will push you around. .... At least that is my experience with them.

 

[MailGuru]

When you lease a car, do they reimburse you for the time you are not able to use it because it is in the shop?

 

[Guest]

When you lease a car, do they reimburse you for the time you are not able to use it because it is in the shop?

I agree with this logic, but different situation here I'm guessing. I'll make some assumptions, but fair ones I think....

The contract with Xerox likely also includes service to keep the machine running. They have a duty/obligation complete the repairs/service in a reasonable amount of time. 5 days in the world of print production is unreasonable by any standard.

Further, in the car analogy, most dealerships offer a loaner car for non-standard service issues to mitigate the impact. Guessing Xerox didn't drop off a loaner machine?

 

[kdw75]

Up until recently, they always had our machines fixed in less than 2-days. Since they started having their former techs work through a third party company, SMS I think, they have been slower. To compound things, they lost a tech in my area last month, so the one guy they have is really stretched thin.

As for how they act when the shoes on the other foot, I can answer that. Last year a four story warehouse next door to us partially collapsed due to neglect. The city shut down the block and barred us from our building. Because of EPA testing of the chemicals in the warehouse, we were shut down for 7 months before we were able to re-open our building. We were able to barely get through the ordeal, by relocating one of our digital presses, and leaning on another local print shop.

We asked Xerox what they could do to help with our growing bill, and their response was to send us to risk assessment to see if they needed to pull the machines immediately. Then after convincing them that we could scrape by, they offered to give us an interest loan on the past due amount in order to get our bill current.

 

[MailGuru]

I agree with this logic, but different situation here I'm guessing. I'll make some assumptions, but fair ones I think....

The contract with Xerox likely also includes service to keep the machine running. They have a duty/obligation complete the repairs/service in a reasonable amount of time. 5 days in the world of print production is unreasonable by any standard.

Further, in the car analogy, most dealerships offer a loaner car for non-standard service issues to mitigate the impact. Guessing Xerox didn't drop off a loaner machine?

Your leasing contract with Xerox, (or any other capital leasing, funding entity for that matter) is seldom ever intermingled with a service contract. In many cases, the leasing company isn't even affiliated with the manufacturer. They are in the business of leasing equipment and making a profit on the interest. In this case, Xerox just happens to "hold their own paper" when it comes to their equipment leases instead of letting that income go to a leasing company. It may be confusing sometimes, because, Xerox may invoice you for your lease payment, and, the service contract on the same invoice, but, if you read the two agreements, each has absolutely nothing to do with the other.

For a lot of high ticket items in print and mail shops (folders, inserters, presses, etc) a business owner may elect to lease instead of purchase for various reasons. In many of those instances, the leasing company is a separate entity that the equipment manufacturer uses in the normal course of their business. Sometimes, the original leasing company may even "discount" (sell) your lease to a totally different agency. If your equipment ceases to function properly, the lease holder is under no obligation to reimburse you for the time you were deprived from the use of that equipment.

Do not think that you are the ONLY injured party when your equipment is down. You are not in this alone. Xerox is also being deprived of the income from clicks off of a machine that is not running, and, they will want to get it up and generating revenue as quickly as possible.

 

[Guest]

Up until recently, they always had our machines fixed in less than 2-days. Since they started having their former techs work through a third party company, SMS I think, they have been slower. To compound things, they lost a tech in my area last month, so the one guy they have is really stretched thin.

Sounds to me like they are making their problems into your problems. They don't get to just blow you off because they can't get their crap together. I would demand compensation.... heck.... all they can do is say "no". Then you can decide if you want to pursue it further or not.

 

[MailGuru]

Up until recently, they always had our machines fixed in less than 2-days. Since they started having their former techs work through a third party company, SMS I think, they have been slower. To compound things, they lost a tech in my area last month, so the one guy they have is really stretched thin.

I would NEVER have service from anyone except the original equipment manufacturer. If a manufacturer does not provide their own service (they make you go through a dealer or other third party entity) that would be a deal breaker for me. I would not buy from that manufacturer, even if they were Xerox.

 

[Guest]

Your leasing contract with Xerox, (or any other capital leasing, funding entity for that matter) is seldom ever intermingled with a service contract. In many cases, the leasing company isn't even affiliated with the manufacturer. They are in the business of leasing equipment and making a profit on the interest. In this case, Xerox just happens to "hold their own paper" when it comes to their equipment leases instead of letting that income go to a leasing company. It may be confusing sometimes, because, Xerox may invoice you for your lease payment, and, the service contract on the same invoice, but, if you read the two agreements, each has absolutely nothing to do with the other.

For a lot of high ticket items in print and mail shops (folders, inserters, presses, etc) a business owner may elect to lease instead of purchase for various reasons. In many of those instances, the leasing company is a separate entity that the equipment manufacturer uses in the normal course of their business. Sometimes, the original leasing company may even "discount" (sell) your lease to a totally different agency. If your equipment ceases to function properly, the lease holder is under no obligation to reimburse you for the time you were deprived from the use of that equipment.

Do not think that you are the ONLY injured party when your equipment is down. You are not in this alone. Xerox is also being deprived of the income from clicks off of a machine that is not running, and, they will want to get it up and generating revenue as quickly as possible.

Understood, but Xerox is deprived of clicks due to their own failure to provide timely repair. It is Xerox's failure that is the direct cause of the loss of income to both the printer and themselves no matter who the lender. Therefore, it is Xerox that should provide compensation for extended downtime. You will still need to make your equipment payment, but should be reimbursed by Xerox service, ESPECIALLY given this circumstance when they have so obviously dropped the ball due to their own staffing/outsourcing failures.

 

[MailGuru]

And, like Kringle says, if you acquired the printer under the premise that Xerox would be servicing it, and now, for some reason that is not under your control, the service is now being performed by a 3rd party, you probably have a very good legal leg to stand on to apply pressure to either get Xerox techs in from out of your area to fix it, or, file a suit to terminate the lease.

 

[MailGuru]

Understood, but Xerox is deprived of clicks due to their own failure to provide timely repair. It is Xerox's failure that is the direct cause of the loss of income to both the printer and themselves no matter who the lender. Therefore, it is Xerox that should provide compensation for extended downtime. You will still need to make your equipment payment, but should be reimbursed by Xerox service, ESPECIALLY given this circumstance when they have so obviously dropped the ball due to their own staffing/outsourcing failures.

Agreed............

 

[Guest]

Xerox is tough! They are like a giant collections bureaucracy that happens to sell and service printers on the side. You CAN win with them, but you have negotiate hard and be willing to follow through.

 

[ID13]

Our salesman once offered to help us get reimbursed for what we were paying for service on the machine, but not the lease. When that happened it was because it took the techs about a week to get out here to take a look at the machine. Might be something worth asking about.

 

[kdw75]

In this case it turns out the machine was useable except for the finisher inserter. With the deadline looming I played around with the machine and found that it worked fine as long as I fed the inserts from another tray. So the jamming was linked to feeding inserts from the inserter only. This was easy to work around and we got the project out, but after having two techs here they can't seem to figure out the problem. We have their supervisor scheduled for a visit now. I told them that since the machine was functional otherwise, it wasn't a big hurry to get it fixed.

I did get a call from someone higher up the service ladder who said they would be happy to help if things weren't fixed in a timely manner in the future.