Remember the good old days of film?

[Slammer]

Not only do I remember I am actually half way through restoring an antique Glunz&Jensen to it´s former glory. However despite all the care in the world some of the little clips that tells you what wire goes where have dropped off, so I now have four wires and no clue as to where to stick them. Also at some point in it´s life the processor has had a rather slap-dash repair, so my question is: "Has anybody got a wiring diagram for a G&J PMR 660?"

 

[bmiller4jah]

Stupid question, but have you tried G&J support?

http://www.glunz-jensen.com/solutions/support-and-service-parts-accessories

Glunz & Jensen, Inc. (USA)
Support & Training Center, Spare Parts & Consumables Distribution Centre
500 Commerce Drive
Quakertown, PA 18951
USA
Tel. +1 267 405 4000
[email protected]

 

[Slammer]

Stupid question, but have you tried G&J support?

http://www.glunz-jensen.com/solutions/support-and-service-parts-accessories

Glunz & Jensen, Inc. (USA)
Support & Training Center, Spare Parts & Consumables Distribution Centre
500 Commerce Drive
Quakertown, PA 18951
USA
Tel. +1 267 405 4000
[email protected]

Yes, they laughed.

 

[Slammer]

I don´t know, a shot in the dark but perhaps one of the brethren or cistern has such a machine somewhere gathering dust or perhaps even still in production and can take detail pictures of the power and relais box under the dryer? That would help a lot. These machines were quite common in the nineties.

 

[Repro_Pro]

The description does't fit G&J processors I am familiar with.
The G&J film processors I know are named Multiline, followed model number which corresponds to film width (older models had two digits, later model three digits, such as 550/720/860/950).
Electronics and relays reside in a drawer under the dev. section.

 

[Slammer]

The description does't fit G&J processors I am familiar with.
The G&J film processors I know are named Multiline, followed model number which corresponds to film width (older models had two digits, later model three digits, such as 550/720/860/950).
Electronics and relays reside in a drawer under the dev. section.

You are thinking waaaaaaay too modern. PMR660 is the tag on the serial number plate, on the cover it is called a "Powermatic R660" and the electronics and relays are in a box under the dryer, I will be posting a few before and after pictures and you can see the martyr-making suffering and anguish I have gone through.

 

[Repro_Pro]

Take pride, you are just like the guys that renovate antique cars or motorcycles.

 

[Slammer]

Take pride, you are just like the guys that renovate antique cars or motorcycles.

Don´t know about that, more like the archeological excavation of a ancient midden, I still have the taste of dried chemicals in my nose.

 

[Repro_Pro]

This model was designed with medium-deep tanks, for Lith or Rapid-Lith film processing.
The developer section looks deeper than the fixer section, indicating it was designed to process camera negatives.
At the time, development was rather slow namely, 45-90 seconds in temperature range of 21-28°C, if memory serves me right.
More modern films processors use shallow racks because they require only 30sec processing (probably usable between 25-60 sec.) at 35°C.
Consequently, if you intend to use the restored processor with modern, Rapid Access films and chemistry, you may need to drive it at much higher speeds than it was designed for, and find that fixing time becomes too short.
So, you may need to find a usable combination of "Cold" developer and "Hot" fixer, in order to overcome the reality that this machine was not designed for today's films.

 

[Slammer]

This model was designed with medium-deep tanks, for Lith or Rapid-Lith film processing.
The developer section looks deeper than the fixer section, indicating it was designed to process camera negatives.
At the time, development was rather slow namely, 45-90 seconds in temperature range of 21-28°C, if memory serves me right.
More modern films processors use shallow racks because they require only 30sec processing (probably usable between 25-60 sec.) at 35°C.
Consequently, if you intend to use the restored processor with modern, Rapid Access films and chemistry, you may need to drive it at much higher speeds than it was designed for, and find that fixing time becomes too short.
So, you may need to find a usable combination of "Cold" developer and "Hot" fixer, in order to overcome the reality that this machine was not designed for today's films.

You are correct, the dev is deeper that the other two baths and now that you mention it I do seem to remember that "old" processors needed to run faster and I also seem also to remember that you could use a higher water to chem mix ratio. In the meantime a kind soul in Germany sent me a copy of the wiring diagram and I am working my way along the wires so to speak, at some point in it´s history the device has had a quick and dirty repair on the electrics and some parts are going to have to be re -wired. At the moment I am waiting for a new set of guides for the Fixer rack and a new set of stainless steel rack carriers. This machine is going to be a beaut. The baths are now clear, I had to chisel out the dried up chemicals and as soon as I got all the electric bits and bats out I chucked it into the van and took the whole unit, racks and all to the carwash for a power clean.

 

[old guy]

i have this tech manuel, i attached just the cover pm me and i will send it if its what you need

 

[Repro_Pro]

Old guy, your SM is for the "modern" - "Multilne" models, the requested model is the old "Powermatic R660".
Now Slammer, if you don't have spare gears you will probably have trouble finding replacements.
You should post here a description with a photo of whatever you may get stuck with and members may help you with left-over spares they may still have.
I certainly will.
Good luck.

 

[Slammer]

Old guy, your SM is for the "modern" - "Multilne" models, the requested model is the old "Powermatic R660".
Now Slammer, if you don't have spare gears you will probably have trouble finding replacements.
You should post here a description with a photo of whatever you may get stuck with and members may help you with left-over spares they may still have.
I certainly will.
Good luck.

This seems to be the start of a wonderful international cooperation to rebuild this processor. Normally such a device would be junked at first glance, but not here on the lovely island of Malta, here things tend to be used and used and then refurbished and used again. The company that I work for is not only a vendor for the graphic industry but also a screen and pad printer and up until now the films needed for making the screens and templates are printed on foil on a Epson inkjet, a method that works, but not spectacularly so, and also you need a lot of expensive ink to get a mediocre density as most here who have tried the same method will confirm. So sometime ago I suggested to get a cheap CTF and use that, as at the moment there is not enough turnover to justify a digital CTS system and then you would still have the need for something to make the pads. So in this case the economics point to a CTF. Recently one of our customers had a Accuset 1000 and this Processor for sale so we got it and brought it back to the company. As I am a old Agfa tech I checked the Accuset out and as far as I can see it is in a good condition, just very dusty, so I stripped it down and gave it a good high pressure air blowout and a clean. Then I started on the processor, sadly the previous owner passed away and the unit was simply switched off and left to collect dust and dry out for a few years. So now I am looking forward to getting this thing back to working condition and to see it back in production.

 

[mkems]

I remember, I like to reminisce, but I don’t miss it.

I worked for Gannett Publishing as a stripper for the better part of 10 years. We had one camera person on the local paper side, and a team of people who received digital film transmissions (essentially a fax to film) on the USA Today side. All strippers were cross-trained in operations for both. Those were huge, DEEP processors. If a jam was happening it was always at deadline, wrapped around the bottom rollers, and never in the water tank--those racks were heavy too. There was nothing like splashing nasty, smelly, chemicals all over yourself and the surrounding area, on the fly, while a bunch of pressmen and various others are breathing down your neck. Oh, and in these situations it was always a skeleton crew, so I was probably burning the plates after reshooting/transmitting the film, and stripping it. (Hehe)

Ahh, the good old days. Thanks for stoking my memories. Have fun!

 

[Repro_Pro]

We also had wide, deep tank film processors in their days.
To handle those heavy roller racks we had an electric lifting mechanism, a drip tray to put underneath the rack after it was up in the air and a transport bridge on wheels to carry it over to the specially built sink.
All that gear was getting more and more use when the processors were getting older...
Yes, it was a nuisance, but an experienced operator could usually get the processor back into operation within 15-20 minutes, without splashing chemicals around.

 

[Slammer]

Hmm! The deeeeeeep processors, always a joy to clean, the largest one I worked on could take a 2500cm wide and 5000 cm long film done on a huge Misomex punch-card step and repeat. And yes you got films stuck on the bottom roller of the fixer bath or it threw a cog or something else that required you to take out the rack.
Still waiting on the bits I ordered, so until then I seem to remember that you can get rollers looking like new with a mixture of bleach and hydrogen peroxide.

 

[Repro_Pro]

Our wide film processors (130 and 160 cm) were technically brilliant, with many features including a unique roller-rack design.
Unbelievable as it may seem, they had (staggered) stainless steel rollers all around, except at the entry table and for squeegeeing at each rack exit.
No sagging in the middle of long rollers, so easy to keep clean.
They were Italian ATAMS processors.
I considered them the Rolls Royce of film processors.
A Danish machines engineer I showed them to was astounded, said he never saw such design before and that such designs were too expensive to produce.
I believe ATAMS had hundreds of their machines working around Milano alone in the Ninteen '70 and '80.

 

[Slammer]

Our wide film processors (130 and 160 cm) were technically brilliant, with many features including a unique roller-rack design.
Unbelievable as it may seem, they had (staggered) stainless steel rollers all around, except at the entry table and for squeegeeing at each rack exit.
No sagging in the middle of long rollers, so easy to keep clean.
They were Italian ATAMS processors.
I considered them the Rolls Royce of film processors.
A Danish machines engineer I showed them to was astounded, said he never saw such design before and that such designs were too expensive to produce.
I believe ATAMS had hundreds of their machines working around Milano alone in the Ninteen '70 and '80.

It seem ATAMS vanished without a trace, at least on the internet.

 

[Repro_Pro]

Their name changed to OVIT.
I guess they abandoned film processing altogether...

 

[turbotom1052]

if you really wanna take a stroll down memory lane and glorify the good ole days why dont you dump film processor and go with tray developing.