What is a good water system for Ryobi 3302

[Grafika]

Hi everyone, by the way nice community! My first time here.

Right now i am workinf with Ryobi 3302 2000 (Ryobimatic) + poly plates from a DPM 2340.

I have a lot of problems whit the water system, these problems has been check by 2 technicians.

Trying to fix the metering roller, getting new roller (ink+water) on each head....

To much water, can't keep density in a process job or not enough water and the screen block.

Can't find the middle! Work with an old itek (copy of 3302) with crestline + metal plates = no problems.

Working with an old Hamada 665, principal head: poly plate + kompac Second head: poly plate with dampening cover (molleton) = no problems!

Kompac: is it a good alternative vs Ryobimatic ? What is the average price for each head for that kind of system ? Without installation...

Thanks in advance!

 

[RGPW17100]

Crestline has been the dampening system of choice for that machine for around 15 years. They are awesome however the rollers need to be replaced every year. You can get an extra six months out of them but the clean up every night is tedious. I think two things. Water is more critical on poly then it is on metal that and the glycerin attacks or plugs the water rollers faster. They are not common but I ran one that had a dalgreen sytem on it that worked really well. It was not a standard dalgreen with the motor but it had a meter and pan roller and form and the system worked really well. They are rare though. Other then that Compac is about your only other option and I dont think they are as good as crestline.

 

[[email protected]]

Just a note

Just a note

Grafika,
The water system on the Ryobi 3302H is really a bad design and it takes lots of tweaking and parts to keep it running. Even when properly tuned it takes forever to get a saleable sheet and maintain a consistent balance. I have been told that Ryobi does not even offer that water system any longer on the 3302H. They now sell a 3302C which is a Crestline type water system. Need I say more?
Kompac’s are ok but for real performance I recommend the Altra series from Accel Crestline. Up to color in 4 sheets or less. Works with Chiller also, which helps running DPM plates.
I have one 3304H and a 4995 with Crestline’s and it will print any job a DI34 will do. I think the cost for the units are $4950.00 per two color press. Make sure you have a good tech install and adjust them not a newbie or a company that only sells D|’s. You will lift that 3302H into a new life.
Good Luck
OG

 

[Bretman]

Crestline, is my vote!!

Crestline, is my vote!!

Grafika,

Crestline has proven superior for quite some time now. I have run many presses with a variety of dampening systems in the last 30 years and I LOVE my crestline!! Of course Alcolor by Heidi is awsum too but you won't get one of those on your Ryobi.

RGPW has a good point in that there is little forgiveness, when rollers shrink you gotta replace em. Crestline only gives ya about 3/32 of adjustment before you're stripe goes dead and I've had a crestline that was wearing out and printed one day and not the next. I ran Kompac years ago, don't care much for the dual nip roller set up and stripe piling on the water form due to no occillation was always detrimental. Don't know if they "fixed" that yet or not.

Also RGPW I use a metal plate when washing with attachement and just drop the forms, the ink sucks off the Crestline just fine and then a minimal rag wipedown. Don't even drip into the pan anymore!!

OffsetGuy makes an excellent point as well, Crestlines need to be installed by someone with experience. They must be level and adjusted properly and leave little margin for error. A bad install will leave you hating life.

Good luck & good printing,

Bretman

 

[Grafika]

Thanks for your reply

Thanks for your reply

Here in my region Qc, Canada everybody talk about Kompac : rep, tech.

I wonder why...

after a few minutes reading all stuff about 3302 dampening system at PrintPlanet, it seems that Kompac is not the best choice...

Thanks again.

Grafika

 

[Bretman]

Well Grafika don't get me wrong. Kompac has probably "fixed" some of their issues since the early 90's when I last used one. They used to be less expensive than the Crestline units for any given press and they "did" do an adequate job for "most" average offset work. The Crestlines I use today are able to pull off better solids & hold screens well. It is simply MY choice, especially when the boss takes in some job that should have been ran on a GTO Heidi and it becomes MY headache on an Itek. As RGPW pointed out, roller maintenance will cost more in the long run, but quality and pressman sanity proves the Crestline a good choice.

Bret

 

[Grafika]

Dear Bretman,

With that kind of answer....i Know what your talking about! ''especially when the boss takes in some job that should have been ran on a GTO Heidi and it becomes MY headache on an Itek''

That will guide me in my choice!

Thanks a lot!

Grafika

 

[RGPW17100]

By roller maintenance I am referring to cleaning with pumice and using a vinegar solution at least weekly. I have found after about a year this becomes a good test as to when the rollers are on their way out. If I have roller problems I will scrub them with the pumice and a soft lint free rag then run water and vinegar and then clean the press.

The roller train on a Ryobi has or at least had ghosting issues. I am not sure what the roller is actually called but we called it a ghost buster. You remove the clean up tray and insert this ocillating ghost buster roller in its place and it will help hide or in some cases remove the ghosting on solids.

 

[Deleted member 16349]

The discussions on dampening systems are very interesting but could the printers and technicians list some specific details so I can get a better idea what people mean when they think the performance is good or bad related to the dampening system.

What are the print performance attributes that you consider as being good which you relate to the design of the dampening system?

And.

What are the print performance attributes that you consider as being bad which you relate to the design of the dampening system?

Thanks.

Erik

 

[Drawkward]

Grafika-

I agree with all of the previous answers. We had a 3302 with Crestline and never had problems and never had to swap out the rollers every year like some folks.

I also have a hamada 660 and 665. One with Kompac and one with Moleten system. I think the Kompac is more user friendly but some of the old school guys prefer the Moleten.

JMHO.

Good Luck!

 

[Bretman]

Erik,

In relation to the Crestline. The attributes I like are that the Crestline allows for a quick set up. When all is right I can get color within 5 - 10 sheets. Water balance stays consistent and a minimal fountain solution keeps my plates clean while allowing me to "hold" a decent solid. Screens stay open and even as well. I use a "common" fountain solution for both metal and silvermaster plates and the Crestine just moves from job to job, color to color well with efficiency.

Detriments are as stated earlier, when the rollers go bad they fail quickly. As RGPW points out there is a bit more maintenance required than on some other systems and roller replacement is costlier.

Over all I beiieve the benefits outweigh the detriments and the Crestline is the better value for performance. Unless you are only running "down and dirty" work.

Bret

 

[cletus010]

don't get rid of the Ryobi system...... you MUST use the Ryobi metering rollers... aftermarket ok on the rest of the rollers... set the pressures right and you will be amazed at the ink these units will lay down... only 1 tech in 50 knows how to set them up... if you want i will sent you the # of a Ryobi tech that knows his stuff and will guarantee his work...