Xerox V280

[batprt]

I have about a year left on my current V180 contract. I have amazing service from Xerox in my area and was thinking about staying with them even thru the toner and drum problems of the past year and a half. I'm considering going all digital in my shop and was looking to get a V280 that has lower specifications than my current V180 and a B9100 B&W for to take care of the black that I would be moving off my offset presses. The prices came in and to say I was shocked would be an understatement. The company I have always dealt with for was bought out by a much larger east coast company that is supposed to have better pricing. If I bought a V280 with the same specifications as I currently have on my V180 the payment would be going up approximately $900.00 a month. I know that things are getting more expensive but that seems like a lot for virtually the same machine.

Does this make sense to other people that have went from a V80 or V180 to the V280? I love my service tech and I worry about switching to Konica or another company but when their numbers come in if they are significantly better I don't think I'll have much of a choice.

 

[azehnali]

what configuration is the $900

 

[MailGuru]

Is there a significant savings in the click charges? When the company I used to be with switched from the V2100 to the V3100, the savings on the click charges with our volume, basically made the lease payment free! It was a no-brainer.

 

[jwheeler]

I have about a year left on my current V180 contract. I have amazing service from Xerox in my area and was thinking about staying with them even thru the toner and drum problems of the past year and a half. I'm considering going all digital in my shop and was looking to get a V280 that has lower specifications than my current V180 and a B9100 B&W for to take care of the black that I would be moving off my offset presses. The prices came in and to say I was shocked would be an understatement. The company I have always dealt with for was bought out by a much larger east coast company that is supposed to have better pricing. If I bought a V280 with the same specifications as I currently have on my V180 the payment would be going up approximately $900.00 a month. I know that things are getting more expensive but that seems like a lot for virtually the same machine.

Does this make sense to other people that have went from a V80 or V180 to the V280? I love my service tech and I worry about switching to Konica or another company but when their numbers come in if they are significantly better I don't think I'll have much of a choice.

I think we need more information to make educated recommendations:

1. How long is the new lease for? If 60 months, that's roughly $54,000 more which is way out of line for the same or similar configuration.
2. Is that $900 including the b/w model?
3. Is that $900 also including rolling over the year of remaining payments due on the V180?
4. Is the configuration of the new machine identical to the V180...meaning it will have the same finishing, paper feed options, and RIP? You said lower specifications, but I'm not clear what you mean by that.

 

[batprt]

what configuration is the $900

It is $900 more than what I currently pay for the V180.
So that would take it to around $2400 a month.

My V180 is performance package
1-Dual OHC Feeder
Decurler w/Inline Spectrophotometer
Inserter with Production Ready Finisher and Bookletmaker
EX 180P Fiery with Compose/Imposer and Color Profiler w/Spectrophotometer

They quoted me for a V280 with the following specs which I was hoping would lower some prices so I could also get a B&W machine. It came in at about $220.00 a month more than I'm paying for the current V180.

Standard V280
1-Dual OHC Feeder
Decurler
Inserter with Production Ready Finisher (No Bookletmaker as I have offline solutions)
Ex 280 Fiery (without the furniture)

I wanted the Inline Spec but they said that adds $350 a month.
Really wanted the Vacuum feeder which would add $150.00 a month.
The fiery software would take it up another $225.00

If I went with the bustled Fiery it would lower the pricing $125.00 a month.

And my Color clicks would go down $0.0032 but my B&W would go up $0.0046.

I did lose some color work since I bought my V180 so my volume isn't really where it used to be but I wanted to stay in the versant line as I've had much better results than I had with my C560 and 252. I love the belt fuser and the stocks it has allowed me to run compared to the lesser machines. I've been a Xerox customer for over 20 years but maybe it's time to really consider switching. But this could be the way the whole market is, I really don't know. I might have to ride out the lease and then see what they'll charge me for service.

 

[batprt]

Is there a significant savings in the click charges? When the company I used to be with switched from the V2100 to the V3100, the savings on the click charges with our volume, basically made the lease payment free! It was a no-brainer.

My Color clicks would go down $0.0032 but my B&W would go up $0.0046.

 

[batprt]

I think we need more information to make educated recommendations:

1. How long is the new lease for? If 60 months, that's roughly $54,000 more which is way out of line for the same or similar configuration.
2. Is that $900 including the b/w model?
3. Is that $900 also including rolling over the year of remaining payments due on the V180?
4. Is the configuration of the new machine identical to the V180...meaning it will have the same finishing, paper feed options, and RIP? You said lower specifications, but I'm not clear what you mean by that.

1. No it's 72 months.

2. No the B&W machine was quoted at about 1200 a month

3. This is still up for debate because it was said when I leased last time that I had a no penalty upgrade after 48 months. And If it does, you would think when I questioned the price the sales person would say, "Hey that includes buying out the rest of your current lease." I heard somewhere that someone ordered a V280 last November and it still hasn't arrived so if that's the case my machine would be out contract by the time the V280 would arrive.

4. I was told the same specs as I currently have would be the 2400ish a month. The lesser machine is 1750ish.

 

[azehnali]

seams a little high
why dont you look into the 4100 also

 

[batprt]

seams a little high
why dont you look into the 4100 also

I don't think I have the volume for that. I really wanted to get 2 machines so if I have an issue at least I have a B&W backup. A good portion of my work is tight deadline and all at the same time. I hope to diversify this more but for those jobs I need to run the volume quickly and being down for a couple days really can be a problem.

 

[jwheeler]

I know the price of everything is going up, but since this is 72mo, that's even more out of line since that amounts to $64k more over the life of the lease...especially considering it's a lesser machine. I'm not sure what they mean by no penalty to upgrade after 48 months. No vendor is just going to forgive the 12 remaining payments. It's getting rolled in and they are not being transparent with you. (I used to sell production gear for KM)

I think it's time to get bids from other Xerox dealers if you want to stay with that brand, and while you're at it, check out the other brands like Ricoh and Konica Minolta. These competitive bids should cause your current vendor to sharpen their prices...and if not, then it might be time for a change. I know change is scary, but many on this forum have shared stories of successfully switching from Xerox to Ricoh or KM due to the recent toner/drum issues. You'll need to request a buyout balance from your current dealer so you can share it with these other dealers (if you intend to upgrade early).

From KM, the equivalent machine would be the C4080
From Ricoh, look at the C7200S or the C5310S

When you go see demo's, they can recommend their appropriate b/w model for your expected monochrome volume. Getting two machines is a smart move. You don't want to tie up your color machine with long b/w jobs.

 

[MailGuru]

I agree with jwheeler. Sounds high. BTW, I have had success in the past by negotiating the click charge down from what they initially proposed. Especially, if it's a B&W click, double-especially if they think you may be going with a different vendor.

 

[Craig]

Get a competitive quote from someone else like Ricoh and let them know they are way to high. Believe me Xerox is a bitch to breakup with. 18 years of nothing but Xerox and they stick it to you when you leave. They even tried to charge click charges for a V180 that was delivered to their lease return center. And yes the invoice was well after the machine was returned and had been unplugged for 3 weeks prior.

 

[TJPrinter]

I had Xerox direct for years and switched to a dealer and saved several hundred dollars a month on my V280. I'm also sure that the dealer worked a lot harder than Xerox ever would have when Xerox made all that defective toner that kept destroying drums. I got close but was never completely down.

If you plan on taking advantage of duplexing heavier coated cover be prepared to replace your 2nd BTR sooner than you did on the v180. There's no real fix for the 2nd BTR on these. The paper path is too short and there's no cooling fans like on the V4100.

I would look seriously at Ricoh or someone else and let Xerox know you're not happy with the pricing.

 

[batprt]

I've talked down clicks and contracts in the past. I still have a year until this is up. I won't be paying off Xerox to just go away, I'll finish this out and have a plan in place.

Konica has been beating down my door for 2 years so they have pricing coming in any day for me. I'm hoping to make it to Printing United so I can see the machines from Ricoh and Canon. All the other printers in my area have moved from their Ricoh's to Konica. I am the only local printer that uses Xerox.

I'll be throwing a fit and if they can't come down I'll play the field.

 

[Shawnd]

When we left Xerox and went to Ricoh we didn't even get a call from the local rep asking what happened, radio silence, which was OK with me. Ricoh came in and bought our lease out to get our business.