anyone use Hostmann ink on a ab dick?

[appleday]

Has anyone used Hostmann-Steinberg ink on a an dick 360? Does it print good or have enough tack? Is it thick enough because some of it seems not very thick? The sales people say it can be used on all presses but then why would anyone make thicker or thinner ink if you can make a one for all... Hope I can get as much feedback as possible from anyone that used it on an ab dick 360, or another small duplicator?

Has anyone used Taniguchi ink on a ab dick 360? Feedback?

 

[appleday]

Which ink did you like better? Which was superior? Did you use it on a duplicator?

 

[appleday]

Personally, I prefer the ink that has 'no color' as part of it

Which ink is that out of the 2 you prefer?

Anyone else use this ink before?

 

[appleday]

Anyone else use hostmann-steinberg or tanigucci inks on a duplicator and can give feedback? I also want to know if hostmann inks have enough tack for a small duplicator?

Any help, thanks

 

[keith1]

Interesting that there's still 360's still around.
You leave out an important piece of information by not telling us what water system you're running. Not to mention that HS can probably offer you a choice of inks.
If you use a crestline, kompac or similar you should be fine. If you use AB Dick's original integrated system, well, I'd suggest you throw that out because it will give you headaches regardless. The offset process was based on the fact that water & ink don't mix, so what does AB Dick do . . .

Based on the tone of your message it sounds like you might be fairly new to printing. A 360 is an old, old machine. Unless it's been rigorously maintained, which I doubt (it's an AB Dick), at minimum the rollers (all of them) are probably shot. Gears & bushings are probably worn. Etc, etc.

Buy a tin of ink and try it. Can't believe I have to suggest that. Keep in mind that a change in inks will likely mean different characteristics. In other words, you may have to run less of it.
Typically using the original integrated dampening system operators would run inks that were tacky (stiff) with varnish. This ink introduced even more problems because it was slow drying - that's if it ever dried - and wouldn't lay smoothly on the paper. OK for crappy black & white forms but photocopiers took away that business from AB Dick 25 years or more ago. Decent quality can be achieved on an AB Dick but it can sometimes be challenging. As the saying goes, if you can run an AB Dick you can run anything.

 

[keith1]

If you'd like to try a sample, I think I still have some 'Van Son Rubber Base Plus' on the shelf. It's decades old but I'm pretty sure the ink is still usable, it never really dries.

Yes! That will work. We used to run that. And there was a Handshy Chemical ink. They're (Handshy) probably not around any longer. There was also 'Tiger' something, from Japan. That Van Son rubber was used a lot on letterpress for numbering etc. You could leave it on the rollers for years I think without it drying.
There were various varnishes / body gums we'd add to other inks to get them to run.
It's been years since I've run a small press, or any press. Funny how one can recall things long forgotten when prompted. I always wondered if I could sue the AB Dick Company for all the grief they caused me over the years.

 

[appleday]

I only have an option between the 2 ink companies I just listed. So I would love people with experience with either of those 2 inks on a duplicator to let me know their feedback. And someone selling tanguci told me hostmann inks don't have enough tack to print good on small duplicators and I would love to know if its true from experienced users with.

Just telling me to try it kills the purpose of having a forum for questions and feedback. If I can't ask these questions looking for feedback then there should be no reason to keep this good forum going. Its purpose is for help and knowledge so we can prevent our selves from wasting time and money.

 

[keith1]

Just telling me to try it kills the purpose of having a forum for questions and feedback. If I can't ask these questions looking for feedback then there should be no reason to keep this good forum going. Its purpose is for help and knowledge so we can prevent our selves from wasting time and money.

Well firstly, you've yet to say what dampening system you use so right off the bat no one can advise you one way or the other. Add to that the many other variables; PH balance, solution, condition of rollers (ink rollers matter too) etc. I've also seen many times what works for one doesn't necessarily work for others. This can generally be tracked back to operator habits - if you're accustomed to piling on a lot of ink (such as with a stiff ink) you're going to have problems using an ink that's less tacky.

It looks like you're in Canada so why you would only have access to 2 ink companies is a mystery. Personally I would have gotten in touch with the manufacturers and asked them what they have available and recommend considering your situation & circumstance.
If you're using a typical dampening system such as in use by most press manufacturers - that is, a system that is not in contact with the ink rollers - you *should* be able to use most inks. I personally have used Hostmann Steinberg inks with AB Dick and similar equipment but that was many years ago. I've used it with Kompac, Crestline and AB Dick's alcohol based system. While I'm still involved in the industry I no longer operate presses. Again, you should contact the company because Hostmann, as with all other ink companies will have choices. They will have different blacks/colours.

If you're running an original integrated system, my best advice is to replace the dampening unit.

Short of this I don't know of much else that can be done to help, short of buying the ink and operating the machine for you.
Try here: https://shop.markandy.com/cgi-bin/catalog/catalog_categories_display.pl?id=319

 

[D Ink Man]

I've used both of those inks before but neither of them on an ABDick. IMO, one of them is far superior to the other one. I understand your concerns about the tack needed for running on a 360, and you can usually specify a certain tack when ordering. At the very least you can ask what tacks are available before placing an order, and then pick the one that's closest to your needs.

You should also check with your vendor because some inks may be available as a free sample.

Tack, Really?

D

 

[D Ink Man]

I only have an option between the 2 ink companies I just listed. So I would love people with experience with either of those 2 inks on a duplicator to let me know their feedback. And someone selling tanguci told me hostmann inks don't have enough tack to print good on small duplicators and I would love to know if its true from experienced users with.

Just telling me to try it kills the purpose of having a forum for questions and feedback. If I can't ask these questions looking for feedback then there should be no reason to keep this good forum going. Its purpose is for help and knowledge so we can prevent our selves from wasting time and money.

I have experience and I will tell you. > If you only have 2 choices with the aforementioned ink companies, I would say I smell a bean counter involved in the fray. I am sure it is not because of contractual agreement, correct appleday? $ Price sounds like somehow is involved here; just feeling from experience, which is what you were, are seeking.

Get yourself some Van Son rubber base inks for your duplicators, OK? Pay $100 for it in a 5 lb. can

Get some Toyo HP process for your conventional presses. Pay $22.00 lb. for the series of process inks.

Spot colors? Do not buy an ink dispensing system for your press room. Go with your local ink goon supplier that will make and deliver them twice a day during a normal 5 day working week (10). Pay $25. for 1 lb. standard spot colors. Pay average $15.00 lb. for 5 lb. standard spot colors. Get slight discount for 48 hour delivery window and expect to pay premium for 4 hour and under delivery. Develop a relationship with your ink MANUFACTURER. Special matches, problem service calls, pro active visits and timely deliveries of accurate matches on your job substrates is what you should seek.

That's how you'll make money as John Doe Printer.

Unfortunately, what I have described may be but a mere fantasy. There may no local ink MANUFACTURER that you can call, develop a relationship with and rely on in partnership.

Why?

Ask the Bean Counter.

D Ink Man

 

[appleday]

The ab dick is pretty much brand new. I know that might be hard to believe but it is. It runs flawlessly. All rollers are brand new. It has a crestline and also has a t head with a chrome roller. The 2 inks I listed are more cost effective and there is also not much other suppliers in Canada. Canada is very limited unlike the USA. And I don't want to ship ink in from the USA because of custom s fees etc.

And yes I am new to printing. I have printed a little bit before with someone on this press and found it very easy. I did not find it hard at all like people make it out to be. It was thier ink and water though. As a matter a fact the person litteraly just used water for the dampening. The ink we used was to expensive though. So I was looking at these two companies for oil base ink. And yes I would love to be able to put a lot of ink on at once instead a little at a time.

Thanks

 

[D Ink Man]

appleday, would it be possible to name your other presses, besides the ad dick, and give an approximate usage of black only, 4/C process work and 2/C work for those presses? That can help narrow it down if you desire the least amount of ink types. We can go from there. Ink pricing can be explained briefly, however do not let it inhibit or influence your operations. Thank you.

D Ink Man

 

[appleday]

That's the only press. And just black and pantone spot colors would be used. On both the press and t head.

 

[D Ink Man]

Give Van Son a little love if available. Now the piece, not the pieces have fallen in place. "1" press, a duplicator. Sorry for the history of the world. Maybe it helped some forum members as coincidence. Hope.

D Ink Man

 

[appleday]

Thanks but some of their duplicator inks are 5 times the price of Canada tanguci or hostmann. They want $105 bucks for the same weight and color I can get from the other 2 companies for $25 bucks. I won't pay $105 for 1.5kg that's crazy.

 

[D Ink Man]

Sir, I believe you might pay and the cost will be higher intrinsically. Just a guess and wish you the best of luck.

D

 

[budgetms]

I ran a 360 with integrated dampening pretty much daily for 20 years, until we closed our shop about 7 years ago. What we found to perform best was Spinx acrylic ink (and for a while another brand of acrylic that Xpedx was selling.) We used it initially with Silvermaster paper plates and later with mylar plates produced on an HP5000 laser printer. It was every bit as user-friendly as Van Son rubber based ink. I always had trouble (and maybe it was me) getting rubber based ink to print densely enough, especially solids, but had no trouble with acrylic ink. We regularly used it with good results on coated stock with Van Son dryer added to the water.

 

[appleday]

I ran a 360 with integrated dampening pretty much daily for 20 years, until we closed our shop about 7 years ago. What we found to perform best was Spinx acrylic ink (and for a while another brand of acrylic that Xpedx was selling.) We used it initially with Silvermaster paper plates and later with mylar plates produced on an HP5000 laser printer. It was every bit as user-friendly as Van Son rubber based ink. I always had trouble (and maybe it was me) getting rubber based ink to print densely enough, especially solids, but had no trouble with acrylic ink. We regularly used it with good results on coated stock with Van Son dryer added to the water.

Did you ever have problems with any oil base ink from any company, or even any tack or were you pretty fine with any brand of ink for the most part?

 

[D Ink Man]

I ran a 360 with integrated dampening pretty much daily for 20 years, until we closed our shop about 7 years ago. What we found to perform best was Spinx acrylic ink (and for a while another brand of acrylic that Xpedx was selling.) We used it initially with Silvermaster paper plates and later with mylar plates produced on an HP5000 laser printer. It was every bit as user-friendly as Van Son rubber based ink. I always had trouble (and maybe it was me) getting rubber based ink to print densely enough, especially solids, but had no trouble with acrylic ink. We regularly used it with good results on coated stock with Van Son dryer added to the water.

I believe this most likely will be your answer appleday.

Now buy some, try it, and don't worry about the price. bugetms has 20 years experience and the ink is already touted as a winner.

Respectfully, don't be a penny wise and a pound foolish. Nothing replaces experience and now you have it.

D Ink Man