Heidelberg versus Komori ?

[D Ink Man]

To all please who have knowledge on this subject; people who have reserched the dynamics of the presses, experienced the operational usage of each press, people who have direct experience with them I ask: If cost were no object and you were allowed to buy the best press for a multitude of reasons, which press would you buy? The only stipulation would be that the press be a 40 inch, 6 unit press with an aqueous coater. Please explain why you buy one or the other. Being specific as possible to why you would choose one or the other is greatly appreciated. I am trying to learn, which we enable me to do my job better. Thank you everyone in advance for your replies. Heidelberg or Komori?

 

[canadian printer]

Ran Both presses. Komori prints well but Heidelberg in my books is far more user friendly great support and will attract more pressman. Komori is cheap but you get what you pay for.Heidi XL is the cream of the crop prints a awesome no marking fast MR to run. I run a Komori now and not a day goes by that I think of my old Heidi.

 

[inkinveins]

If money is no object, why did you leave KBA out of the discussion ? BTW, I recently had a customer tell me there is two things he considers when buying a press : How reliable it is, and How much it costs.
Every printer has different criteria.

 

[Cornishpastythighs]

We have Heidelbergs and a new Komori. Komori is as one person said the cheaper of the two but I have to disagree that it is a 'cheap press' We have found the Komori good value for money. We researched all the major press makers before buying the Komori but money was an important part of our decision as the Komori was a couple of million less than a Heidelberg 105 or a KBA. Our research told us that in fact the KBA was a better press than both of them for our type of packaging work but it was also the most expensive so you do get what you pay for.

 

[Mike LaForest]

I have run Heidelberg (18yrs) and Komori (12yrs)both have benefits and draw backs
Price goes to Komori (more bang for your buck)
Heidelberg holds color better , but Komori prints a better dot!
Komori's deliver better at higher speeds , but as everyone here has said it comes down to preference!
Heidelberg service and attention to detail is legendary but in the last few years that has also changed .
Currently we have 3 Komori's... hope that muddies the water even more

 

[NGA]

If money were no option i would be placing an order for a XL today. My personal opinion is that the heidelbergs print a much sharper dot, but a komori can usually run alittle fast. for the market my company is in, quality is more important that quantity. However teh new XL's should make up the quantity gap.

 

[RKS]

We were a Heidelberg house and had 6 Heidelbergs (1-6+coater). We replaced them with 2 new Komori's (10 color perfector & a six color), both with coaters. We now have more capacity than we had with the previous presses. We have now won the most best of category awards (11 & 13) in our PIA region for the past two years. If the Komori couldn't print excellent and be reliable, we couldn't have done this. Of course we have excellent personnel, but the quality of the machine is also very impressive. So, for paying $1.3 million dollars less than Heidelberg, we received great equipment and produce an excellent product.

 

[Mitsuguy]

It is easy to see by my user name that I am a Mitsubishi employee. If you are looking at quality and production you should open your minds to more than the 2 companies you have talked about. I have complete knowledge of both and they are good machines. I know the thread is labeled Heidelberg vs. Komori but I had to pipe up. In the market we are currently in you should look at all options. At Mitsubishi we have several options that really work. If you are a shop that only prints 4/4 you can run a machine that is dedicated for that market. If you need coating over coating we can also do that. If you are a shop that needs to have the option of running 8 colors straight on your press than we also have a convertible type press. As for dot reproduction the Japanese companies will always produce a better dot. All that plus our machines don't have the need to be limited for press speed when in the perfect mode (16,200 sph in straight or perfect). If you really want a true comparison check out all your options.

Tom

 

[Johu]

Funny how things are different on your side of the pond . In Europe Komori is the more expensive press and here people who buy Komori think it is worth the extra buck... But to be honest both are really top presses so it comes more down to the facts like service and other side stuff. I have no currant info on the speeds of the 40" machines but in the B2 (4up) size Komori is definately the more productive machine because of it's very fast job to job changing (I know that there is a better word for that but I hope you got the point.

 

[spigot]

Heidelberg but only because money is no option, so who cares how many million i must print per month just to pay the service agreement HAHA!
Komoris are good presses too. I recently saw one on the way to 300 million with only routine maintenance and it would go from a fine screen to a solid to anything you like with nothing more than a washup.
But the Heidelbergs are built to a standard, and if i could trade in the shitohara press im running now to go back onto a heidelberg i would do it

 

[tambo]

Komori operator for over 20 years, great machine, and definitely a money maker. Even seen avid Heidelberg operators very impressed with Komori performance.

 

[The Heidelberg Guy]

Today, still go with a Heidelberg, even though Komori has much improved over the years...

15 years ago, I wouldn't even consider a Komori!

 

[dFlesburg]

We started up our first new Komori in Sept of 00. In 7 years we ran it 300 million impressions, and would have kept it but we were up against a glass ceiling, and in 08 we started up another new Komori this time an SP 440 which doubled our capacity. Our old one was traded in. (It is still running).

1. The Komori is very well built and required less service as it approached 300 million impressions that we would have had with a Heidelberg. (Based upon what Heidelberg users have told me)

2. The Komori has makeready automation "nailed". We change over job to job more that once per hour (full 4/4 MRs) and quite often paper changes, and the press still amazes us. We did not see the same performance when we watched Heidelberg users do MRs in their shops.

3. The Komori is an excellent printer with dots as sharp as or sharper than any other press we studied. We visited a lot of shops and watched a lot of presses MR and run.

Just my 2 cents worth. That and $5 will buy you a cup of coffee.

Good luck with your decision.

 

[Alois Senefelder]

Merits

Merits

Hello fellow Lithographers,

The last sheet-fed press I worked on was a French - Voirin Press ! - - so I decline giving my opinion on the merits of Heidelberg - V - Komori and the rest, but the Fidelity of Dot Reproduction on any press also depends on Plates/Blankets, Ink and Paper not forgetting the competence of the printer, neither of which any press manufacturer make.


Regards, Alois

 

[mruiz]

Why you only talk about Heid and Komori, what about ManRolands?

 

[The Print Doctor]

Man roland

Man roland

I cannot believe manroland came up in a conversation about Heidelberg and Komori. All I can say is shame on you and open you own thread for MAN, the most over engineered over priced thing out of Germany since the Hindenberg! Oh BTW it only crashed once my MAN roland crashed all the time. Heidelberg and Komori are the 2 best sheetfed machines on the market period.

 

[inkinveins]

Barring the recent recall on the Toyota braking issues, we all know that Japanese made products are built to last. I believe this also holds true with their printing presses. Very little maintenance with superior results. Dot reproduction is almost a non-issue these days with CTP manipulation. In my opinion it is mostly about efficiency, where I think we can all agree that the Japanese excell at. It will always be a subjective argument that unfortunately will always be affected by emotions, instead of cold hard data.

 

[Servicetech]

You are going to see a lot of brand loyalty asking a question like that. I have seen (insert brand here) guys run down the competitions product while never having operated one or turned a wrench on one.

I serviced Komori presses for over 20 years, so i will say that they are among the finest printing machines on the planet, but that's about all I can say, as I have very little experience on a Heidelberg to compare it to.

 

[Ultra007]

I've been in the printing industry for over 30 years in production, production management and equipment sales. I spent 12 years at one of the major manufacturers as Product manager and District Sales and have learned all the machines inside and out. The "best" machine, no such thing. "Different horses for different courses" seems to fit. Much depends on your business mix, your location, your available pressmen and your expectations. I now consult on used equipment and can see the "bigger picture". Heidelbergs are fine machines for some Customers, Komoris are a super production machine, Mitsi's are fine, Rolands are very nice and KBA's are running beasts too. No one machine is best for everyone. I've seen dogs of all machines and have seen extreme performers of all makes too. The old saying (most likely coined by a German) that the Japanese machines are cheap or throw away machines just isn't true these days. As Mitsu guy stated, keep your mind open and do the research into what works best for you. And by the way, it pays to hire a qualified consultant to assist in your search! lol