Looking for "Onyx Profile Workflow" Series

[Kristar]

I am looking for a copy of this training series DVD Onyx has created. I have emailed Onyx and they have discontinued this and our out of stock. If you have any info as to where I could pick this up it would be muchly appreciated.

KAR

 

[PrePress Guru]

Hi Kar,

If they the 2 dvd series with a basic and advanced, I have both of the DVDs and they are horrible.
Not only the production value but in the topics covered and techniques demonstrated.
By the time they released them, a new version had come out and they were obsolete.
They also contradicted many of Onyx's own standards and support staff.
Last but not least they were geared towards only solvent/eco solvent printers.
Many of the terms and techniques demonstrated only applied to those printer types.
Since i have an epson and hp aqueous printers, the dvd's only served to confuse me.

Sorry for the rant but id rather you know.
-ian

 

[Kristar]

Thanks Ian

Your "rant" is appreciated. Like you, I work with aqueous dyes, and if the series is geared towards solvents - it may frustrate me more in my quest for a better understanding of profiling through Onyx.

Cheers
Krista

 

[Ford Prefect]

They have posted an online guide for profiling. Here's the link below:
Profiling Guide

 

[PrePress Guru]

The online profiling guide is less then helpful.
For the high cost of ProductionHouse, they should provide us with a real manual describing profiling in detail.
I would strongly suggest anyone considering purchasing any Onyx product think hard about it. They do not provide adequate support for users. No useful manuals and they make you pay for support on top of the purchase price.
I wouldn't have an objection to that if the RIP didn't have so many bugs and no useful documentation.
They have really let us all down. Btw, i was promised many time that a new Media Manager manual and training guide would be forthcoming. Obviously a lie. Later a support person once admitted that they have no plans to provide the user base with a manual until version 8 or 9. He couldn't tell me why but a few months later, they started to charge for support. It all makes sense now.
Kick us while were down! The Onyx Graphics way!

The rant aside, i have tried other rips and ProductionHouse is still the top for me. But i wouldn't recommend it to anyone without a large disclaimer.

-ian

 

[Ford Prefect]

The profiling guide is the manual they talked about.

Last I heard Onyx support doesn't get any feedback for end users on what's good or bad about. It might be a good idea to send them what specifics you dislike or found confusing. I know they'll appreciate that.

 

[Kristar]

Books on basics of profiling?

Books on basics of profiling?

Ian you are so right - I do love to profile in Onyx , but, ran into the very frustrations you are talking about. It really is too bad that the support could be better. I have been through every inch of the online manual and there is still so many more questions I have. I may be old school but I do prefer a good paper manual to read.

Here is another question for all out there - Is there a good text book out there that may not be software specific but, deals with the basics of profiling. Maybe I am asking too much - I've been through my old Interior design colour texts and boned up on the real basics, but, would like to understand more.

Thanks
krista

 

[PrePress Guru]

Hi Ford (im a big hitchhikers/adams fan too),
I have contacted Onyx many many times regarding the many problems. They are indifferent to the majority and dont care about some of them.
They are so focused on Solvent, flatbed and the like that we AQ users are left wanting.
I can understand that they have a specific market that is a cash cow but to deny your user base a real manual because you want to make money on expensive training is wrong.

I paid a lot for my RIP and i feel cheated. I have told them this and again, indifference.
I really wonder if i call in about new problem, which i have a lot of, will they charge me for the privilege of reporting it? I dont have the money to pay for a support contract but i assumed when i bought the rip it would be useable. The last stable version was in the 6 ish range. The v7's are buggy but useable.

A good example: One of the KEY features of Onyx for me is the Auto Rotate and Nesting.
The Auto Rotate will not work on my Epson 9880. It has something to do with the coding of resolutions. I have to manually rotate every file and basically do the work that the rip was supposed to do for me. Also rotating files in Pre Filght is a hit or miss. 1/4 of the time it doesn't work and it doesn't show the rotation in rip queue.
I reported this over a year ago and nothing in the build notes and the apps are still acting the same.

Also the Layout app is fantastic if it would work at all. I have never been able to print anything from it using the Epson 9880.
I reported this also and its still a mess. If it would work, i would be so happy.

Krista,
A great book on profiling in general is Color Management 2nd edition by Fraser.
I have it here and its a good primer with a lot of intermediate and advanced material.
Its something i would definitely have on your reading list.


Thats another Onyx rant but it has to be said. They have seriously dropped the ball on support and bug fixes.
I still cant believe they want to charge us for support when the RIP should be a beta.

-ian

 

[Ford Prefect]

PrePress,
Glad to hear you have great taste in British literature. I think we need a Douglas Adams Day. It should be on the 42nd day of the year.

Color Management, by Fraser is indeed a good book. That was my first book I used to learn about color. If you want to get more in-depth on color workflow and the history of it all, Principles of Color Technology by Billmeyer and Saltzman is a great one. This one is a bit more advanced and does deal with some complex math, but a great read regardless.

I found information on the onyxgfx.com site that mentions best fit and allow rotate only work with square resolutions. Resolutions like 1440x720 won't work.

Happy Coloring

 

[Kristar]

Absolutely! to a day 42 celebration! Don't forget to bring your towels.

Thanks for the colour management books suggestions, will pick them up and read.

Krista

 

[PrePress Guru]

We do need a few days, maybe on the 42nd day and every multiple of it just to be safe.
He was one of the great writers. My father turned me onto him years ago and i read everything of his i could get my hands on.

I remember the article on the site but im still annoyed. It was a promised feature that only works on certain printers. That is not mentioned in the sales literature when i bought it. False advertising maybe? Anyway, it seems to me that this is a bug and should be fixed like so many others.

I think they are spending a lot more time on prep edge and the flatbed/solvent market that doesn't need the little things that we like.

One day, maybe when we learn the ultimate question Onyx will deliver version 42 and all will be well in the RIP world!

-ian

 

[ScottyDoo]

The online profiling guide is less then helpful.
For the high cost of ProductionHouse, they should provide us with a real manual describing profiling in detail.
I would strongly suggest anyone considering purchasing any Onyx product think hard about it. They do not provide adequate support for users. No useful manuals and they make you pay for support on top of the purchase price.
I wouldn't have an objection to that if the RIP didn't have so many bugs and no useful documentation.
They have really let us all down. Btw, i was promised many time that a new Media Manager manual and training guide would be forthcoming. Obviously a lie.

The documentation is most definitely lacking, and you are far from the only person who is frustrated with both their level of support and provided documentation. They have one gal who has been working hard on getting their documentation updated, but I think they still have lots of room to improve. It's nice however to see them moving in a direction that seemed to have died off. The main problem is getting it in a useable, searchable form for end users. A series of PDF's isn't much help when you can't locate them online anywhere, and all you have to go off are the file names. They need to be indexed and online. I may just end up doing it myself on my site.

Later a support person once admitted that they have no plans to provide the user base with a manual until version 8 or 9. He couldn't tell me why but a few months later, they started to charge for support. It all makes sense now.
Kick us while were down! The Onyx Graphics way!

Although I haven't been involved in the specifics yet since they started active development, I do know that v8 is supposed to be quite a bit different and will require all new documentation anyway, so I imagine that they intend to put their energy into the new stuff...which obviously does not help everyone else out there. In previous conversations with them it would appear that the plan was to pretty much start from the ground up, so it will be interesting to see.

I have a direct line with Onyx, so please feel free to post your suggestions and ideas for v8. They are listening and take the suggestions I pass them seriously.

OnyxTalk.com - 8.0 Wishlist & Product Ideas

 

[ScottyDoo]

I paid a lot for my RIP and i feel cheated. I have told them this and again, indifference.
I really wonder if i call in about new problem, which i have a lot of, will they charge me for the privilege of reporting it? I dont have the money to pay for a support contract but i assumed when i bought the rip it would be useable. The last stable version was in the 6 ish range. The v7's are buggy but useable.

Feel free to post any problems over at OnyxTalk.com (sorry, not intending to self-promote so much). I setup the site specifically for reasons you mention. There was no place for Onyx users to go online to ask questions and get help from other Onyx users. Things are still small and just starting to take off, but there's some great users over there, and there are even a few Onyx support technicians that pop on from time to time and help out.

I think I'm going to start putting together my own user populated database or at least a listing of people's main issues that have not been resolved and see if we can get some better answers. I'd love to hear what problems you're having. I won't personally have the answers to all of them, but I do have a tight relationship with Onyx and might be able to get some better information atleast.

A good example: One of the KEY features of Onyx for me is the Auto Rotate and Nesting.
The Auto Rotate will not work on my Epson 9880. It has something to do with the coding of resolutions. I have to manually rotate every file and basically do the work that the rip was supposed to do for me. Also rotating files in Pre Filght is a hit or miss. 1/4 of the time it doesn't work and it doesn't show the rotation in rip queue.
I reported this over a year ago and nothing in the build notes and the apps are still acting the same.

Also the Layout app is fantastic if it would work at all. I have never been able to print anything from it using the Epson 9880.
I reported this also and its still a mess. If it would work, i would be so happy.

I'll find out what the latest on this one is and see if it's back in engineering or not and what the roadmap is for it is (which hopefully there is one).