Metal FX alternative, and 5 color Seps?

Without taking 10 pages to explain, a few points about CMYK Metallic printing:-

Technically anyone can print CMYK combinations over a metallic silver, but has mentioned several times above proofing and visual simulation on screen are the problem. With regards the ink situation, metal FX, with eckhart, developed a special formulation of ink called silvercoat. This differed from standard silver inks (877 etc) in that firstly it had was lighter, therefore not contaminating the CMYK colours as much as normal silver. Secondly it is a "non leafing" silver which in it's simplest form means the metalic particles in the ink remain suspended in the film weight rathe than "leafing" to the surface. This allows a varnish or lamination to be applied without effecting the metallic lustre.
Proofing, is very hit or miss. The Kodak approval, lantum etc can produce "metalic" proofs. However as they are all dry thermal processes they do not simulate the effect of wet trap printing which can dramatically reduce the lustre. Therefore the proof you get off these types of machines is usually much more metallic than you will actually achieve. MFX was developing a ribbon based proofing system whichsimulated the wet trap effects but has the business closedthis wasn't completed. The only true proofing method is to "put on press"
With regards screen simulation, the ICIS sytem, esko visualiser (former Print devizor) or profiling a ncolour profile is that the profiles in the visualiser, and any you create with profile maker have only 1, 45 degree measurement. What they simualors then do is change the area off metallic to this new colour space and then literally put a varnish on to make it look "shiny" this again looks good, but bears no real comparison to the printed result. Again MFX had just developed an visualiser which had measured the metallic affect from many angles and so the profiles were multi leveled giving a very accurate colour representation including all the effects that can be acheived with CMYK over metallic.
I know I a seem to be promoting MFX, which is now defunked, but the physics and reality of metallic printing is not simple, and they spent 7 years on R&D.
My advice would be to seek a non leafing silver from your supplier, running trials on your press and working from there.
A final tip, in your design always ensure that the deaign has areas of contrast between metallic and non- metallic (about 60/40 either way). Avoid fine intricate detail in metallic as the viewer will never pick this up. Reds and Yellows make poor metallics (brown and green), so any reds and yellows in a design keep CMYK and then make the areas around them metallic. The reds and yellows will then lift out of the design.
Finally avoid metallic in shadow areas. This is for 2 reason, firstly the ink build up on top of the metallic willkill any lustre, therefore making it a waste of time. Secondly the TAC level will probably exceed 340%, causing potential drying issues.
One other thing, screen angles, keep the silver on the same angle as the black and ensure minimum silver in areas that contain black. This will avoid screen clash.
One positive. If you print UV, has the silver will be dry trap, the lustre is much higher, to the extent that kodak approvals are much nearer the final results, and are a feasible method of proofing.
Hope this clears a few things for you.
 
However as they are all dry thermal processes they do not simulate the effect of wet trap printing which can dramatically reduce the lustre. Therefore the proof you get off these types of machines is usually much more metallic than you will actually achieve.


Great Post markingman! I haven't used MFX but have seen it before, it's got some great effects.

Kodak has looked at the wet-trapping vs. dry-trapping overlays and adjusted for it in the software.. can tell a funny story about that (if the NDA's expired?). I participated in the development of the Recipe color system at my previous employer, and worked pretty closely w/ several of the guy's on the development team. They also gathered lots of proofs and press-sheets on the metailic donor. But proofing to the Metal substrates were difficult at the time (6-7 years ago? Gawd I feel old suddenly), because the heat from the laminator would affect it too much. We found it made the proofs look chalky, not as vibrant and glossy (but still, pretty damn impressive for an 8-color PMS label!). I saw some of my old friends a year ago when investigating the Matchprint Inkjet for my current employer, and they were showing off their new metalized and non-distorting plastic substrates (I used to have to tape the shit to old plates and chuck it in the vacuum frame!)

... I swear, I don't get commission, I just loved working w/ the KA's.. LOL! :D

- Mac
 
Please speak to your usual ink supplier. Most good ink suppliers should recommend an alternative. Metal FX was just principles that other printers and ink suppliers had used for ages packaged as a new product to sell on. If your supplier/rep doesn't know ask to speak with their technical people to provide an alternative. The only difficulty you may have is in the proofing stages. Your existing supplier should be providing help and advice. If not, try someone like SunChemical or Sericol. Their tech people are shit hot.
 
For proofing there is no cheap alternative no matter what people claim. The Kodak Approval proofing system is about the most accurate proofing system I've seen. Expensive though and not at all forgiving. If your file hasn't been set up properly it'll cost you.
 
Like Mark said, Metal-FX can still be used, because the ink supply is guaranteed by Eckart, that is the world strongest company in metallic inks. My opinion is that it should be used. There are some distributors in the world that may still have licenses to sell.

We are the exclusive dealer in Portugal for MFX, we started in 2008 and sold 23 printer licenses in 6 months. The results were impressive and clients were amazed with the effects. When I knew that MFX was going to close, I bought 5 printer licenses for stock and 20 design licenses. At this moment I have 2 printer licenses and 10 design licenses. So if anyone is interested, they could contact me at [email protected]

I still hope someone will buy the Metal-FX company in the near future!

What I say is, if MFX really finishes, the printers and designers that use MFX, will have a almost unique product, that works, and can differentiate even more from competitors.
 
but how well will mfx be supported if the company is out of business. operating systems change, adobe rolls out new software very quickly. i am not saying productions jump quickly but software support will be lacking and it's hard to convince management to venture into such an investment.
 
Please speak to your usual ink supplier. Most good ink suppliers should recommend an alternative. Metal FX was just principles that other printers and ink suppliers had used for ages packaged as a new product to sell on. If your supplier/rep doesn't know ask to speak with their technical people to provide an alternative. The only difficulty you may have is in the proofing stages. Your existing supplier should be providing help and advice. If not, try someone like SunChemical or Sericol. Their tech people are shit hot.
Just t clarify, the MFX ink is slightly different from eckharts normal ink, as many trails were done to adjust the tack level to aid the trapping/drying issues.
 
Like Mark said, Metal-FX can still be used, because the ink supply is guaranteed by Eckart, that is the world strongest company in metallic inks. My opinion is that it should be used. There are some distributors in the world that may still have licenses to sell.

We are the exclusive dealer in Portugal for MFX, we started in 2008 and sold 23 printer licenses in 6 months. The results were impressive and clients were amazed with the effects. When I knew that MFX was going to close, I bought 5 printer licenses for stock and 20 design licenses. At this moment I have 2 printer licenses and 10 design licenses. So if anyone is interested, they could contact me at [email protected]

I still hope someone will buy the Metal-FX company in the near future!

What I say is, if MFX really finishes, the printers and designers that use MFX, will have a almost unique product, that works, and can differentiate even more from competitors.
Excellent thread Fillippe. I wish you had told me that you still had licenses to sell. I have had several enquiroes and have had to tell them that no licenses are remaining.
 
but how well will mfx be supported if the company is out of business. operating systems change, adobe rolls out new software very quickly. i am not saying productions jump quickly but software support will be lacking and it's hard to convince management to venture into such an investment.
The point of the MFX software was it's compatibility. The advantages it has is that it is "software" as such. It is a set of actions and pallettes, which adobe haven't changed since CS. Therefore I predict the "software" will work indevinitely.
 
MetalFX

MetalFX

Hi,

My name is Richard Ainge and I was the CTO for MetalFX. I was also co-founder, inventor and developer. After MetalFX was purchased by Ciba, who incidentally ceased issuing MFX print licenses at the end of December 08, I left and formed Color Logic Ltd based in the UK. This was aimed at supporting the users of MetalFX along with developing new products to take to market after the closure of MFX.

If a printer requires a MetalFX printers license and the associated design packs, swatch books and plugins, then these are still available to purchase. I know because I have stocks of them as I still sell and support MFX through international distribution outlets! Of course seeing as MetalFX has ceased to trade due to the corporate decisions made by Ciba, I am now offering to continue the technical support through my new company - so, if a license is purchased it is still supported, and seeing as how I was the one that ran the training programs and did the global support, it means nothing would change for the users. Everything is supported from design, pre-press, inks, printing etc, and as mentioned inks are still available and will continue to be so.

If you are interested in still using the MFX products, please do not hesitate to contact me and I would be more than happy to discuss any questions that you might have.

It should be noted that MetalFX and any intellectual property, knowhow yada yada is protected by patents still held by Ciba (I have to state that just in case big brother is watching :D )

regards

Richard Ainge
Managing Director/President

[email protected]
 
Having been in an organization that used some of the methods you've mentioned above, I agree that:
metal color needs to be laid down first;
solvent inks will create a better outcome than UV inks due to the dulling opacity of UV inks;
screen prediction is not possible--this is a trial and error effort that you can only get in the ball park using sophistocated software;
proofing on a Kodak Approval or Fuji system is relatively close but does not match UV's opacity effects;
this effect/process is only useful for certain images and a waste on many images;
6/c and Hexachrome is significantly better suited for achieving results.
Good luck.
 
Wrong Company!!

Wrong Company!!

Has I have the contract for the Metal FX support for the next year, I can offer this advice. If you are a printer, and aren't licensed you will not be able to buty the ink. If however you are a designer, you could contact a licensed printer to get the job printed, and they will hold the software and swatches for you to be able to design the job with. If they are a recent purchaser of the license, they may also have the mycolorviz visualisation software which would aid the design process. You can find all the license printers by using the search engine on the metal FX websire Welcome to MetalFX� Technology +44 (0) 1943 88 48 88. Alternatively, Colorlogic Uk Ltd are metalFX specialists and may be able to aid you further.
Has to an alternative, I am unaware of any product that goes as far as the swatch book, so prediction would be difficult.

Nearly correct with the company name Mark.... It is Color Logic Ltd (Color Logic) and not Colorlogic UK Ltd, the later is for hair care and as you are aware Mark, I don't have any hair ;)

cheers

richard
 
Having been in an organization that used some of the methods you've mentioned above, I agree that:
metal color needs to be laid down first;
solvent inks will create a better outcome than UV inks due to the dulling opacity of UV inks;
screen prediction is not possible--this is a trial and error effort that you can only get in the ball park using sophistocated software;
proofing on a Kodak Approval or Fuji system is relatively close but does not match UV's opacity effects;
this effect/process is only useful for certain images and a waste on many images;
6/c and Hexachrome is significantly better suited for achieving results.
Good luck.

Agreed, there are many technicalities that printers and designers need to consider when printer or using metallic inks - the main problem I found was that clients never asked for help, nor did they take advantage of the FREE design assistance that MetalFX offered. This was a simple system whereby the client could email low res images, PDFs etc and ask for guidance on whether the files were suitable for turning into metallics, and advice was also given to the client telling them which bits to make metallic, which parts to leave as process and all this was done on the actual files that they were working on, not something that was pre-designed in-house my MFX that could have been "frigged" to work. Real live training was always critical, however many clients were never made fully aware of this by distributors that simply sold a system in what I used to call a "hit & run" manner. MetalFX also offered FREE monthly WebEx training programs where customers could invite their clients to join in and train any number of designers, pre-press, printers, sales teams and marketeers. The most common problem I came across with users of MFX was that people would just through any old image through the system and expect it to simply pop off the page with a WOW factor. As rightly mentioned by eastppress that just isn't enough. Clients that took advantage of the free support, free design assistance and free on the fly learning benefited from the fact that they never had to run test after test after test wasting plates, press time, inks, man hours etc. Nipping issues in the bud at the design stage was all part and parcel of the services offer by MFX.

The good news is that these services are still being offered today, although no longer through MetalFX :D
 

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