POD quality vs Offset

[roclimb]

This might be a silly question but does anybody know of a digital print on demand system that is capable of printing the same quality as an offset color press? If so is there an economic system?
Thanks
Rob

 

[JayDA]

Short answer....NO.....depending on what you're trying to achieve....

Can you be a little more specific?

 

[mac_man_luke]

Indigo would be better than offset under the right conditions

 

[pierreborg761]

Yes NEXPRESS digital machines from KODAK. Very nice machine and low cost per page. We have sold one here in Malta and the customer and his clients are overwhelmed.

 

[FM2365]

The answer is absolutely. The new iGen4 has quality that is very impressive and holds its own when compared to offset. Especially if you apply a coating to the piece, you would be hard pressed to tell the difference. The machine will also mirror the PMS SWOP as well. We installed ours at basiQa in January and our clients love the quality.

 

[JayDA]

The OP said "economic", a Nexpress or an Igen4 is hardly an inexpenxive solution.

Everyone will go on and on about their particular brand of this or that, "better" is a very subjective term. There are some very fairly priced machines that are better at some things, and poor at others, it depends on what exactly you are doing with the equipment. Instead of asking broad stroke questions, you're better off seeking advice about what you're trying to accomplish. What is the actual job in question?

Photos?
How much coverage?
Paper weight?
Simplex/Duplex?
Coated/Uncoated?
VDP?

I could go on forever.....

 

[nicko1972]

the answer would be no
digital is getting better but is not as good as offset YET
those that tell you differently are probably selling digital machines and have no offset background

 

[bantonm]

Note my reponse is fairly broad based due to the question;

Answer is yes in regards to the first part of your question and no to the second. The discussion now is not so much about quality but more about what quantity is economical to print digital. In general more than than 2000 impressions offset is more economical.

We have just installed three c 8000 machines from KM after extensive print trials using the same test files across all high end digital devices. The quality of these machines is as good as any other high end digital machine in the market based on our print trials. Test files were also run on SM52 5 col offset machine.

The files were general jobbing CMYK offset work (brochures, flyers). c8000 could match for quality and overall appearence. Even our offset printers who are anti digital were stunned at how far digital quality has come. In some cases the black solids looked better on the digital jobs.

 

[roclimb]

Thanks for the responses. basically I'm looking to print color books with a photo every two pages, I'm looking for a print on demand solution to keep cost low. So im looking for offset press quality for a 100 to 150 page books, trying to pay in the realm of $3.00 per book if it's possible.
I understand this may be completely unrealistic.
Rob

 

[JayDA]

Note my reponse is fairly broad based due to the question;

Answer is yes in regards to the first part of your question and no to the second. The discussion now is not so much about quality but more about what quantity is economical to print digital. In general more than than 2000 impressions offset is more economical.

We have just installed three c 8000 machines from KM after extensive print trials using the same test files across all high end digital devices. The quality of these machines is as good as any other high end digital machine in the market based on our print trials. Test files were also run on SM52 5 col offset machine.

The files were general jobbing CMYK offset work (brochures, flyers). c8000 could match for quality and overall appearence. Even our offset printers who are anti digital were stunned at how far digital quality has come. In some cases the black solids looked better on the digital jobs.

3 C8000...wow! I'm about to install my second one on Friday...Fiery or Creo?

 

[FM2365]

Wow, $3.00 per book will be tough to find. That would equal out to $.02 - $.03 per page. I ran some quick numbers and the best I think you will find for full color would be $.08 - $.09 per page. Then you still have to trim and bind the books. If it were B/W you could easily produce your books for that cost, but color will be very difficult. Good Luck!!!

 

[X33]

"Quality" is subjective. I could tell you that my printer at home has offset like quality, but it won't be realistic for an experienced user like you. You need to look at some samples your self with your own eyes and decide. I would look at the big boys: Xerox iGen, HP Indigo, Kodak Nexpress.

"Economic" solution, also subjective. What is economic to you? A piece of equipment that costs $10,000, $100,000 or $1,000,000. Your value of money is different from others; first, where are you from?

I see you are trying to print some books at $3 a piece. Getting to that cost will also depend on print volumes, size of the book to see how many you can fit in one sheet of paper, what kind of paper you want to use, turnaround time, labor, etc.

I strongly suggest you contact someone from Xerox, Kodak and HP and discuss this further.

 

[roclimb]

Thanks for the responses. I know some other people in my field who are publishing color guidebooks and getting them for about $3.00 a book and doing runs of about 2,000. They are being printed overseas. I was hoping there might be someone here in the U.S that could do a similar job, the only way I could postulate getting such a low price was if it were done POD but with a digital printer and not a full offset. again, I know it might be a stab in the dark. I just would love to keep my $$$ here in the U.S. supporting a local printer or just a US printer. Any solution would be beneficial on both ends.
thanks again
Rob

 

[LKent]

Still annoyed at the ridiculous answers of some of the salesmen/women in this forum, as I am also interested in entering the paper printing business, but many people like to just respond without concern for the person posting.

That said...I am in the screen printing business, and from what I gathered, let me put this out there. Offset printing is comparable to Screen Printing. It requires a setup charge and is meant for volume printing. Reason why its cheaper per page with a certain minimal volume is because the ink itself is cheaper, but better then digital.

Digial garmet printers have entered th market, but can never compare to screen printed products, because the INK. Compare a screen printed product to a digitally printed shirt...hands down screen printing wins because digital printers are not yet capable of handling a thicker, better ink.

With that information in hand, you must consider what you want to do first when entering a printing segment of the industry. Do you want to do photo printing? color documents? color critical marketing materials? in bulk? variable?

What I noticed is eveything costs money and its not a cheap business. And this is just the printing side now add bindery to the mix...

I know the frustration I feel it daily in choosing the right products, but there are many quality choices that are economical. I recently seen the new Canons, Ricoh and KM at a show. Nice products and WAYYY cheaper when Xerox. But for my reasons I'm a fan of Xerox, which wasn't at the show . But Figure out what you are trying to do first because there is no one printer then can do it all, as most commercial shops like to use a mix of machines to accomplish different tasks/clients.

Also take into account your location and service support in your area...as this is key. Also order some paper stock that you want to use, coated and uncoated, and take them with you to demo on these machines with the type of documents/graphics you expect you use the most, with different colors. Match them under a good light source and compare. Good luck.

 

[LKent]

Also another solution is a b&w printer and a color printer. With a b&w printer you can cut the cost of the click charge vs printing black text pages from a color copier. Problem is you have to organize the pages...oh the pro's and con' of life...