Prepress Workflows

[markfish54]

I have been working with my Prepress Manager trying to decide which is our next workflow and we will choosing between "2". Rampage or Prinergy. I (we) would like to find a couple of locations to vist and get the real scoop without the "Sales" people. We are located about 50 miles east of Chicago. Anyone open to this?

Thanks in advance....

 

[mattbeals]

Have you though of augmenting your existing workflow instead of outright replacement?

 

[markfish54]

Actually I have not. We are currently using AWS and have had a few very bad experiences with them. So the opportunity to replace is at hand. Not having a prepress back ground (20 years in manufacturing IT) I am depending heavily on my prepress manager which is looking at these 2 applications, leaning in the direction of rampage. I 'm leaning in the direction of Kodak. My reasoning they are both good workflows, my focus is more in the area of automation and WTP. I have heard that rampage support is much better than kodak and would like to visit a shop or 2 some where close if possible.

Thanks

 

[Ritter]

I would encourage you to take a look at Heidelberg Prinect especially since you are considering Kodak Prinergy. I am a Prinect user and think the automation in this process is far more effective not to mention it has some really powerful tie-in potential with the process beyond prepress.

A suggestion:
Since you are already in Chicago go to the show and ask to drive. When prompted for credentials make it appear as you actually have no real say in the purchase (i.e. i'm just a preflight peon at a local shop and stopped by to see what the big fuss is with the show). Salespeople are busy and I suspect will be especially busy with the down economy this year trying to make deals/coerce contracts. They most likely don't have time to deal with peons and won't bother with you. You'll have access to the guys who work with the users as well as install and trouble the software and equipment.

 

[pcmodem]

I have heard that Rampage is very similar to AWS (Nexus). I don't know from experience. Someone else told me they prefer Nexus over Rampage.

 

[jbbbarr]

I have used both Nexus and Rampage and I prefer Rampage by far, but the Prinect commenter is also correct in that it is a very capable system offering more integration than most workflows.

They all have their pos & neg, familiarity and cost will usually make most decisions in the end.

 

[mattbeals]

I've used Brisque, PS/M, PS2, Harlequin, Prinergy and a limited amount of Prinect. My preference is Brisque, but since that's gone it's Prinergy. However... I have never heard *anything* from RAMPage users that was not very positive about RAMPage support. From my personal experience with Scitex/CreoScitex/Creo all I can say is that if you knew the magic words then getting support wasn't a problem. Even better was when you had the D.I.D. or cell phone number of the field techs and response center members. If you had those, there wasn't anything you couldn't get. I have not heard anything about Prinect support though.

One item of note is that with RAMPage has integrated Callas pdfToolbox 4 SDK into their RIP for in RIP preflighting.

 

[PDL]

Since the acquisition of ArtWork Systems by Esko-Graphics, now EskoArtwork, a lot has changed. It may be well worth your while to look at all the additional options now available.
One immediate advantage would be the upgrade paths available to build on your current system, (with the sweetener of upgrade pricing), and being inline for some of the innovations being based on some of these technologies to come. We're all about automation, MIS integration, and more these days. Plus we can easily provide you with current users and references. Packaging and printing pre-production solutions - EskoArtwork

 

[[email protected]]

and why will change your Prepress manager, is the best of all

 

[TerryWyse]

All prepress workflows these days are more-or-less very capable. Don't be overly "wowed" by marketing language and hype...look for a system that is productive and gets the job done right and doesn't rely on all sorts of fancy job editing options.

And Matt Beals is exactly right....Rampage's tech support is 2nd to none in this business. The "best" system may come down to has the most knowledgeable and responsive tech support staff.

Regards,
Terry

 

[srawding]

All prepress workflows these days are more-or-less very capable. ...look for a system that ... gets the job done right ...

Well said Terry,
Any change needs to improve your ability to deliver to your customers. Consider the strengths/options of the workflow. Kodak connects well with Kodak devices, Rampage has some great trapping. If you don't acheive an improvement in problem areas, consider upgrading what you have.

Sherman Rawding

 

[Fatboysmart]

I would include Heidelberg Prinect in your list too. No BS system, very reliable and highly productive. I compared it with prinergy and it didn't come close... way too cluttered in my opinion.
Just my 2 cents...

 

[Eric van der Kop]

I have been working with my Prepress Manager trying to decide which is our next workflow and we will choosing between "2". Rampage or Prinergy. I (we) would like to find a couple of locations to vist and get the real scoop without the "Sales" people. We are located about 50 miles east of Chicago. Anyone open to this?

Thanks in advance....

To realy be at help I should have more info, like what kind of plate making system do you have and/or do you have a digital press etc.
I software that i have seen mentioned is Onevision.
ONEVISION - OneVision Software AG
I think i is great but just have a look.

 

[Eric van der Kop]

I have been working with my Prepress Manager trying to decide which is our next workflow and we will choosing between "2". Rampage or Prinergy. I (we) would like to find a couple of locations to vist and get the real scoop without the "Sales" people. We are located about 50 miles east of Chicago. Anyone open to this?

Thanks in advance....

To realy be at help I should have more info, like what kind of plate making system do you have and/or do you have a digital press etc.
I software that i have seen mentioned is Onevision.
ONEVISION -Â*OneVision Software AG
I think i is great but just have a look.

 

[2ndShiftProblemSolver]

Have you looked at Agfa's Apogee Workflow?

Have you looked at Agfa's Apogee Workflow?

As was stated earlier, they all do about the same thing and it's a matter of finding one that does what you need it to do in a way that YOU or YOUR Operators understand. That being said, I've worked with alot of different RIPSand workflows over the years (PSM, PS2, Brisque, DALiM, ORIS, etc.).

<Begin Agfa commercial>

Apogee works well and is really easy to learn / use. Much of it's structure makes more sense to Brisque users than Prinergy does. Job tickets and template automation are a natural for brisque users to pickup in Apogee - not so much with Prinergy.

Agfa was the first with true PDF workflow and online web approval (soft proofing) systems. They continue to be a leader in developing workflow. They were the first to put out stable software using the PDF print engine (Kodak bombed on that one). Agfa also stays ahead of the pack when it comes to JDF automation.

</End Agfa commercial>



If I was shopping for a new workflow, I'd have EVERY manufacturing and or dealer rep in my area getting me quotes and demos using MY files. Then, I'd get quotes with consumables wrapped up too so I could "bundle" my pricing and get an even better deal. That would mean sitting through a few webinars, possibly some plant tours, and probably trying out a few different plates, but in the end it'd likely be worth the time.

 

[marktonk]

I would encourage you to take a look at Heidelberg Prinect especially since you are considering Kodak Prinergy. I am a Prinect user and think the automation in this process is far more effective not to mention it has some really powerful tie-in potential with the process beyond prepress.

As Ritter stated, you may want to look at a system that encompasses more then just prepress.
What can it do for you with a integrated MIS, pressroom and bindery? Point to consider, if you have a new Heidelberg press such as a XL 105, the digital information can not only preset the ink keys, we also preset about 25 other settings on the press such as side guides, powder spray length, dryer settings, infeed gripper height, etc. So although prepress systems may have allot in common, not all provide the same level of "shop" integration.

Regards,

Mark

 

[UncleSam]

What kind of problem with your current workflow?

What kind of problem with your current workflow?

I just want to know what kind of problem your prepress manager have with the current AWS workflow? What AWS workflow you have now? Nexus? And why have a bad experience with AWS? is it because there is no service contract? With the current economy, I would rather to fix the problems than to invest big money for a whole new system. I don't know if anyone will agree with me?

 

[Nitzsche]

What about Dalim Twist and Dialogue? It looks nice for me. Some one use it?

 

[mattbeals]

Dalim is a very capable system. We don't hear much about them here in the US, at least I don't. But those who do use it love it. I think Dalim is the system that RR Donnelley uses for all their heavy lifting of pages rather than Prinergy. Maybe that's changed... I have a magazine publisher who uses Dalim and they love it.

 

[2ndShiftProblemSolver]

DALiM

DALiM

I absolutely loved DALiM when I was first introduced to it in the mid 90s. Since then, I moved on to ORIS and then Apogee and have not kept up with it's developments.