Upgrading from Fuji Xerox 700DCP to Versant 80

[BigSi]

Hi there, Is this worth it?

How much of an improvement am I going to see in-

Registration (sheet to sheet)
Straightness of image (seems to go out quite quickly on the 700)
Colour consistancey on longer runs (Reds are all ways a problem on my 700)
Laying down large coverage (banding is again a problem )
Overall print quality

If we are only looking at a 5-10% improvement in most of these areas it would not be worth it with the additional cost.

My volumes are not huge so a slightly cheaper click rate is not a big factor.

Your thoughts and comments are very much appreciated.

thanks Simon

 

[Baldbug]

Our volumes were not huge either with our 700i. We did 1.3 million in 3.5 years. Lots of little jobs. Lots of little problems.
We didn't want to continue with lots of little problems so when we saw a Versant 80 with similar peripheral devices that our 700i had attached to it we decided not to go down that path. The Versant 80 print engine was producing very good results and samples we obtained are excellent, but we are over Friction Feed and continual paper jamming in the peripherals we had.

 

[BigSi]

Thanks Rodney. Nice to hear from someone in this part of the world. I'm an offset printer by trade so I to tear my hair with all the problems associated with this kind of kit
but what other options are there? not a lot, (like your everything is very short runs) but keen to get feed back on the Versant. Changing the subject, me and my wife are visiting Tasmania for the first time just after christmas and are looking forward to seeing your beautiful state.

 

[Baldbug]

It's unusually extra cool this winter with lots of snow and frozen roads, black ice. We have a Heat Pump (reverse airconditioner) which keeps temp at 21C in press room. Humidity is 38% today so far. After Christmas the weather will be great.

 

[BigSi]

Getting back to the subject!
Anyone got any thoughts on how much of an improvement is the Versant is on the 700?

 

[Windward]

We are also considering an upgrade from the 700 to the Versant 80. We have compared sample jobs from both machines and the Versant 80 has slightly better resolution and color. We now spend a lot of time on paper alignment and the Versant will automate this. There are some design changes that should allow the Versant to yield more consistent color but we'll have to see if this is actually true. The Versant 80 will print duplex up to 300 gsm and handle paper up to 350 gsm. Both of these are improvements over our 700. The new version of EFI Command Workstation also has some improvements we like. However, I'm also not sure if these incremental improvements are worth the approx. $60k it will cost for the Versant 80. We are also looking at the Ricoh 7110 series. I'll post more as we have new info.

 

[BigSi]

Thanks Stanley. Look forward to see what conclusion you come to. Like you I feel the Versant is a better machine but the question is "how" much better. ta Simon

 

[wildcatt]

We just did the 700 to V80 Upgrade. The 700 was our backup and our 770 was our main machine. Now the 770 is our backup. We were sceptical, but are very happy with the V80. It runs much smoother with less issues (once you understand how it works) Our staff was able to adapt to the changes quite quickly. Our bindery staff is also very happy with the improved registration. As long as you have the volume, its a good move.

 

[BigSi]

Thanks, Yep the feeling I'm getting is it's quite a bit better overall. I'm a little disappointed that Xerox are only overing a click rate of 2c less than my old 700. ta Simon

 

[BigSi]

Hi Guys, any more thoughts on the V80 over the 700? Keen to get real world experience rather than just information from the spec sheet. ta Simon

 

[TJPrinter]

We are now running the V80 after having the 700 for 4 years. You will see a significant improvement in registration, front to back and sheet to sheet including skew (straightness). Reading about SIQA alignment I thought it was just some more techno talk-do-nothing, but it is a great tool that will get your sheets registered perfectly front to back in a couple minutes. When I hold up the sheet to check the registration most of the time I can't see the back side register marks because it's dead on. This is a huge time saver and improvement over the 700. The same goes for image transfer, print out a sample on your stock, pick the density you want or place it on the platen to scan and let the V80 decide for you.

Card stock and text weights come off the V80 flat as I put them in. Speed is significantly better, I run a lot of coated stock and it's almost double the speed as the 700 and I don't have the pro version either. Large solids look better too, but even offset presses can have problems with certain large screen tints. Keep in mind I'm comparing to the 700 not to others, but when someone says they don't see an improvement in gradients I have to wonder if they know what a gradient is. There is a significant improvement with blends and gradients!

I never had many jams with the 700 other than trying to run a stock or envelope it wasn't rated for, so friction feed is fine with me. The V80 prints envelopes very nicely, no need to open flaps and hope for the best. I can't help you much on the finishing, I do all my finishing offline. I'm willing to lease the engine, but I want to own my finishers.

Is it worth it? I think so. Xerox took a little off my click rate like they did for you. So figure if you increase your number of clicks you should offset the extra you're paying on the lease. Xerox has provided me with outstanding service on the 700 so that's a tough one to walk away from and jump to some other vendor not knowing. Hope this helps a little!

 

[BigSi]

Thanks TJ. This is the sort of information I am looking for. What machine do you use for your offline finishing? I'd like a Morgana but I don't the price they go for. ta Simon

 

[TJPrinter]

I'm with you on the price part. I like to look for gently used when possible. I've been using a Watkiss Vario Slimvac with good success. Morgana may rebrand one of the Watkiss booklet makers.